Hat tip to Brandon Chase for this. Also check out his blog.
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thiswould be funny if i knew you werent making fun of the church
This is ridiculous. Those Bakers cannot afford to pay 135,000 dollars for the “emotional distress of lesbians”. We have every RIGHT to fundraise and help out our brothers and sisters.
I don’t see anything in this cartoon about bakers. Huh?
I think you are reading too much in this.
Thanks. Yes, I didn’t have bakers in mind when I posted this either.
he makes light of of everything
Oh, ok. . . Fine. I just had a girl tell me the other day and adamantly defend the idea that Jesus would have endorsed pedophilia, because he taught “love” and in the Bible he says to “let the children come unto me.” So right now, maybe my sense of HUMOR has been a little SEARED by all the bad, “theology” ( i.e. Porno for Jesus, Abortion for Jesus). etc. . .
On our knees.
Well here is reality. The above is unreality and the opposite of it is unreality. Speaking the truth in love is reality. When a Christian is unloving it is wrong, when a Christian is untruthful it is wrong. The above cartoon is deceiving as it gives the impression that forgiving or turning the other cheek is the only part to be played by Christians. Speaking out against evil is right and it’s always right. So if that is fighting back then I am fighting back.
I intend to fight back with love and truth.
Jesus wasn’t on His knees in the Temple. Paul wasn’t on his knees when admonishing Peter. David wasn’t in his knees when he faced Goliath. Romans 13 states the government isn’t on its knees in enforcing what is right. When good men do nothing it is an evil. Jesus told his disciples to sell their possessions to buy a sword. It sounds very pious to be on ones knees and certainly there is a place for that. In every circumstance no scriptural support.
Mark, I am not sure what you are arguing, or if you understand what I was saying by posting this humorous comic.
You seem to be assuming all sorts of things about me that I don’t believe, and about this comic strip which it doesn’t say. (It seems like we’ve had this exact conversation before.)
Jeremy you put out the cartoon. Could you please define it for me? If you put the thing out and it’s not defined by you what on Gods green earth do you think I will do? Define it? Uh duh… I find you provocative and a runner. What do I mean by runner? I have engaged you quite a number of times and you throw a very provocative piece out there and then if I call you on it you take offense. Then I persist with my argument and you disappear. I know you will deny this, as I am used to it with you. Now looking at that cartoon TO ME Jeremy because you have made no interpretation yourself I see a very wish you washy view of people who take a strong stance against attacks on Christianity. I also see a response by the cartoon Jesus that represents a shaming ” hey it’s all about forgiveness and turning the other cheek”. I lastly see a cartoon that attempts to categorize all Christians who do this as violating Jesus commandments. Now that’s my interpretation. What’s yours Jeremy? Do I have aright to my own interpretation? Seems to me if you expect a certain response you shouldn’t free float this stuff out there?! … Finally Jeremy I do recall a little about an encounter we had last winter and while not remembering the exact issue I know it had to do with conservative talk show hosts. You took an obscure (to me) host who said some off the wall things and used it to castigate conservative talk show hosts under the same banner – I paraphrase the quote” conservative talk show host spewing their hatred…” Or some such phrase. I called you on it by stating that have you ever heard that from Rush Limbaugh, Mark Levin, Sean Hannity or other MAINSTREAM conservative voices. No response. You ran away. Finally I will finish with this: I see what you do frequently is throw a very one sided provocative OP out there and seem to expect no one to see the obvious one sidedness about it. I don’t hate you but to me you are exasperating because you so frequently deny the obvious when you throw these things out there. Sorry to be so long winded- but please interpret yourself first if you throw something like this out there and don’t shame people because they take a certain view.
Mark Richard, if Jeremy is so bad, why are you hear reading this? Do you deliberately hang around the sites of people with whom you disagree, so you can lecture them about how wrong they are? Jeremy has the right to put the content on his blog according to his beliefs. If you don’t agree with it, time to move on?
My interpretation is you state Lets fight back! I took that as sarcasm based upon previous posts you have done…. Is that wrong if me? I mean I can’t figure you out: what do you believe? The OP is ambiguous at best and your blip above it could be taken FIGHT BACK or agreeing with the cartoon.. I take the latter view. If you don’t respond I won’t be surprised…
My response to on ones knees was in response to another commenter.
Mollie Lyon. …. So Jeremy you are responding to me responding to someone else….sheesh…..
My other post was about the cartoon and not you NOT you. So you are accusing me of stating things about what you believe? How dare you! You are way out of line. You are attacking me by saying I am ascribing anything to you when in neither post did I. That’s a wrong attitude Mr Myers. I know I may seem like a madman with all these posts but when I am falsely accused I will fight back.
Mark. Are you actually a Christian? Just wondering? You seem like a very angry man.
Wow.
http://subversive1.blogspot.com/2014/08/how-to-fight-like-christian.html?m=1
The anger and rancor I see is unsettling. I am conversing with a Christian who is having trouble keeping her faith because of how other Christians have treated her. She has won souls for Christ but is battle worn by “frenemy fire”. You are the only Bible someone may see. There is a big difference between opening it with someone and hitting them over the head with it. Just sayin.
so good
I think what we really need is Wisdom, which is knowing at the right time to do what needs to be done.
We shouldn’t be surprised when we as followers of Jesus are persecuted, Jesus promised this would happen. If we help the oppressed we are doing what we are supposed to do. If we strike out at the oppressor we are buying into the lie Satan told Jesus when he offered the power of all the kingdoms of the world.Jesus never ONCE railed against the brutal Roman regime or criticized their political system. He was here to conquer through love and fulfill the law – not conquer the world with the sword. Revival has always followed great persecution.
So, when did mockery become an expression of love? And if a Christian can’t stand by a moral conviction that’s as clearly delineated for us by Jesus and his apostles as the issue of sexual perversion, what on earth can we stand for!
Let us not forget it was Jesus who said to his persecutors “If I speak the truth, then why do you strike me?”. There is nothing inherently good or loving about not confronting injustice.
As far as I know there are no real Christians wielding literal swords, but we are commanded to take up our spiritual armor for battle, against the powers of darkness. In my opinion any law that perverts God’s holy institution of marriage is a force of darkness that does indeed require of us resistance.
We are to attempt to correct, not confront. Return love for hate, tolerance (not acceptance) for intolerance. We are to present (and represent) truth, not attack lies.
BTW, presenting an argument need not be confrontational. =)
I simply do not understand many of the comments on this thread.
Did I say something about bakers or pedophiles that I missed? What is going on in your head that makes you think this is what this comic is referring to and that is what I had in mind by posting it?
Lighten up! Relaaax. 🙂
If we cannot make fun of ourselves, we might as well crawl into a hole and die. If we cannot make fun of ourselves, it is no wonder nobody wants to be a Christian.
Making fun of ourselves is perfectly acceptable! Its the mocking of other believers who are responding in good conscience to an issue of dire consequences that’s not cool at all! Pretty sure anyone getting fined for doing the God honoring thing is not amused by such simplistic and flippant satire.
To me, being a Christians is not about “having fun” at others peoples expense. Its about serving the Lord joyfully. Do we need to be putting someone else down to enjoy our lives?
Ben,
Thanks for straightening me out. That’s what a good Christian brother should do. Especially when you know my motives and what’s in my mind better than I do. 😉
Jeremy, you did nothing wrong and there is nothing for you to apologize for. I find it very disturbing that our brothers and sisters in Christ in many places in the world are actually under attack and their lives in danger for their witness for Christ. I follow the news closely and see nothing in the USA that even remotely resembles their situations.
Although I don’t know what the cartoonist intended, Jesus clearly stated that those of us who follow him should indeed love our neighbors, and that would most certainly include those we perceive to be our enemies, Sadly, very, very sadly, I do not find that in most of these comments. In my opinion, it is time to turn the comments off permanently so that the rest of us may once again enjoy your blog.
Comments on the blog have been turned on for one day and already I have to remind several of you of the comment policy: https://redeeminggod.com/comment-policy/
Personal attacks, name-calling, accusations and unkind, unloving comments will be deleted in the future. At this time I am not deleting the comments already on this post so that others may see examples of what is not acceptable.
People, this is a Christian blog. You can do better.
.
Once upon a time, a mother made her son a wristband. On it was written: WWJD? This, of course stood for: “What Would Jesus Do?” She instructed her son to look at the wristband before making decisions on how to live his Christian life.
A week later she was shocked to see that her son had become friends with prostitutes, was hanging out with ‘sinners’ — even buying people who were already drunk yet another round of beers!
Worse still, he had walked into their church the previous Sunday and tore down the book store, overturned the tables and threw the cash register through the window, he then made a whip and chased the pastor out of the building, declaring he was turning God’s house into a den of thieves.
Most shocking was what happened when his mother went to picket the local abortion clinic. To her embarrassment, her son was also there, but he was standing with the women who just had an abortion, and yelled at the protesters: “You who are without sin, throw the first stone!”
The mother was very distressed, but fortunately she found a solution to this terrible problem. She made another wristband, this time it read: WWAPD? This, she explained to her son, stood for: “What Would A Pharisee Do?” She took the old WWJD? wristband and burned it.
Since her son has been wearing the new wristband, looking at it to help him make his decisions, he has become a dedicated tither, a public prayer warrior, an active condemner of ‘sinners,’ a passionate defender of the Old Covenant law, and has a great reputation as a godly young man amongst other religious people.
Needless to say, the mother is very happy now. She only wishes Jesus would take notice and follow her son’s good example.
Jeremy, you seem surprised by some of the comments to your post of this cartoon. While I’m not saying that I agree with every person who has disagreed with you (I’m not even sure they’d all agree with each other), I am not surprised that you provoked some critical reactions. The reason someone would not just laugh, say “Amen,” or otherwise acknowledge the truth of the cartoon? The context. When I think about which Christians in America (because that’s where we are, and nothing in the cartoon prompts me to think in any other context) are currently being attacked, I think of bakers, photographers, florists, and others who are facing court battles, onerous fines, and other non-trivial difficulties because they feel conscience-bound to refuse service – not to homosexuals – but to support homosexual wedding ceremonies. Top of mind is the news story of the last few days in which a baker in Oregon is facing a fine of $135,000. That would probably put any baker out of business. Some Christians are contributing to help them, but if the government keeps this up they will be able to levy more fines than Christian generosity could ever pay. In this context, the point of the cartoon seems out of place. I can imagine contexts in which the cartoon would be quite fitting, but the current context seems quite different. Most of us feel compassion for the Oregon baker and would not feel comfortable sarcastically implying that they ought to respond as Jesus did. As best I can tell, most of them are responding as Jesus would and I feel humbled by their example. These are my thoughts and I hope they help you appreciate some of the angst among our brethren and why it may be difficult for them to take cartoon in the way you hoped they would all take it.
As I said to someone on Twitter about this post, for some reason, I am always surprised when people respond negatively to these sorts of things.
To be completely honest, I live here in Oregon, and I had absolutely no idea what was going on at that bakery. I guess I have been living under a rock or something
So the bakery event had nothing to do with why I posted this comic strip, and for people to accuse me of some sort of ulterior motive which is in their own head but not in mine sort of shocked me as well. I said nothing about a bakery and knew nothing about it until today when I decided to google it. But they jumped to conclusions, make snap judgments, started pointing fingers, and so on, without ever stopping to ask me what I meant by posting it.
Which is exactly the problem.
It makes me think that maybe, just maybe, we aren’t getting the whole story out of this bakery incident. Maybe someone jumped to conclusions there too, made some snap judgments based on ignorance, and now Christians everywhere are up in arms about it.
Jeremy, the story about the Oregon bakers has been ongoing for months (the $135,000 fine is just the latest development), is well-documented (with involvement by reputable Christian organizations seeking to help the Kleins), and has been carried by multiple news sources. Whether or not people were making snap judgments in making critical responses to your post is one thing, but I think it’s unfair of you to suggest that folks whose hearts are broken over what has happened to the Kliens, Barronelle Stutzman, and others like them might be making snap judgments based on ignorance.
Mike,
That’s not what I meant either. I was referring to the way the media is reporting the story and how some people might be responding to the way the media is reporting the story.
Do you think Christians are under no attack? What exactly is the “fighting back” that you see?
Wow! I really didn’t see either of the last two responses coming.
Jeremy, if your change of heart about this post is genuine I am grateful beyond words! Only spiritual giants refuse to take offense at the reproofs of a brother. You just moved up a notch on the maturity meter in my book.
Jose, I am sorry you view genuine conscientious concerns as legalism. It was Jesus who told the woman caught in adultery to “Go and sin no more” not the Pharisees. I too am turned off by legalism, but I think you’re painting with a brush that’s a bit too wide my friend. The Jesus I know is both Holy and merciful. If Jesus didn’t mean for us to be Holy on a practical level, as well as a positional level than the joke is really on Him. And I am pretty sure He is Sovereign enough not to let that happen.
Try reading the last section in C.S. Lewis’ book “Mere Christianity” called “Beyond Personality”. He explains our Lord’s words “Be ye perfect as I am perfect” and shows that He really did mean what He said.
Ben,
Well, to be honest, you better move me down a couple notches in your maturity meter book (I’ve heard rumors of those, but never actually met anyone who has one).
Anyway, I don’t actually think you know my mind better than I do. I simply think that the reason and intent of my posting this comment has been completely misunderstood by many. I think Dan sums it well below.
I thought the point of the story when Jesus said “go and sin no more” was about not looking for the sin in others. It’s very curious to me why this verse gets used so often to justify pointing out others’ sin.
Put another way, we should all be looking in a mirror, not into other people’s windows. That is what a “peeping Tom” does. 🙂
I don’t know that anyone is going to challenge me on the point of Jesus moral perfection but Matthew 5:48 actually reads “Therefore be perfect even as your Heavenly Father is perfect.”
Curious discussion. I’m not sure it followed from the cartoon, which I liked. The cartoon doesn’t seem to have a particular context or issue du jour. Rather, it pushes against a posture of self-defense – a culture war where Christians take up arms (literal or metaphorical) to preserve their rights or force their opinions. I think the cartoon rightly pushes against that attitude. On the other hand, we are in a war, but our weapons aren’t carnal. Our weapon is the self-sacrificial proclamation of the Gospel. That often involves speaking truth about sin. To us has been committed the words of reconciliation. Those who are without sin need no Savior. But our purpose in confronting sin is not self-defense, or self-satisfaction, but reconciliation..
Thank you Dan. I too do not see that the discussion followed from the cartoon.
Well put Dan. You helped me to find redemption in a cartoon that originally struck me as simplistic and carnal as the people it was mocking.
I totally understood the context of this cartoon as soon as I read it. To me, at least, it was pointing out that as Christians, we are to share the truth in LOVE! It was not saying–Don’t point out sin–But it WAS saying, do it in the loving way Jesus did. He was firm but loving. He did not back down, but he was not hostile and antagonistic which is what many Christians come across as. This cartoon is simply showing that we were not called to transform the government or overthrow the political powers that be. We are called to be transformed so that we will know God’s will and be able to show others how to know Jesus. Jesus and the Apostles never sought to overthrow a worldly system. They simply shared the Gospel. I liked this cartoon.