I sometimes get asked if I believe in “Once Saved, Always Saved.” One reader recently sent in this question:
Can a Christian lose their salvation?
The old saying is once saved, always saved.
I have two ways of answering this question, both of which are stated below.
1. Why I do NOT Believe “Once Saved, Always Saved”
The reason there is so much debate over this statement is because of the word “saved.” As I have written about on numerous times previously, the word “saved” (and other related words such as “save” and “salvation”) are used in a variety of ways in the Bible. When you do a study of the ways these words are used, it quickly becomes obvious that the vast majority of them have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with anything related to gaining or keeping eternal life.
So, for example, the word “saved” might refer to being delivered from one’s enemies, or getting healed from a sickness, or being rescued from drowning at sea. Obviously, these words are not related to gaining or keeping eternal life. I would guess that the majority of times the words saved, save, salvation, etc., are used in Scripture, they are used in this way (e.g., Matt 8:25; Acts 27:31).
Another percentage of words refers to various ideas that are related to eternal life, but are not eternal life themselves. Often, the words in these contexts refer to some aspect of sanctification, or maybe getting rewards at the Judgment Seat of Christ, or some other related idea (cf. 1 Cor 3:15).
Finally, there is a tiny fraction (I would say less than 1%) of uses where the term probably does refer to receiving eternal life, though even in these contexts, the actual meaning of the word is debatable.
In Acts 16:30-31, for example, the Philippian jailer asks Paul and Silas, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” They answer, “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” On the one hand, it seems that the jailer might have been asking about how to receive eternal life. But frankly, at this time, that may not have been the primary question on his mind. At that time, if a jailer let prisoners escape, the jailer would be tortured and killed. Maybe the jailer was not asking how to get eternal life, but how to be delivered (saved) from being killed by the authorities. This reading is possible. I am not sure how the jailer meant his question, and so don’t mind reading it either way. Besides, whatever he meant by it, Paul and Silas answer the most important question, which is how to receive eternal life: believe in Jesus for it.
There are a few other examples of places where the word “saved” could be understood as eternal life, or could be understood as referring to something else (Eph 2:1-10 is one), but these examples are less than 1% of the uses in the Bible.
But here is what happens. Most church-going people assume that the word “saved” almost always means “get forgiveness of sins so you can go to heaven when you die” even though it rarely means that. So when they come across a passage like 1 Corinthians 15:2 where Paul says the Corinthians will be saved only if they hold fast to the word that was preached to them. And people say, “See? If you don’t hold fast, then you aren’t saved? See? Once saved, always saved is false!”
Right. But what does the word “saved” mean in this context? Is Paul really talking about the concept of “forgiveness of sins, escaping hell, going to heaven when you die?” No, he is not. Paul is using the word “saved” in the same way he uses it in 1 Corinthians 3:15. The word “saved” in 1 Corinthians refers to reward and honor at the Judgment Seat of Christ. This is something Christians can lose.
So the question, “Do you believe in ‘Once Saved, Always Saved?’ is a trick question. There are numerous verses in the Bible which indicate that there are some things in our Christian life which can be lost, and these texts use the word “saved” to talk about how to be saved from losing these things.
So do I believe in “Once Saved, Always Saved?” No. I do not. This slogan is unclear, imprecise, and does not fit with many Scriptures which indicate that there are many spiritual blessings in the Christian life that can be lost.
2. Why I believe “Once Saved, Always Saved”
Of course, after saying what I have said above about “Once Saved, Always Saved” I always try to then answer the question that people are really asking. When people ask if I believe in “Once Saved, Always Saved” what they are really asking is if I believe that eternal life can be lost. That is, do I believe in eternal security?
And the answer to that is a resounding Yes!
Once you see the difference in Scripture between the word “saved” and the terms “eternal life” or “everlasting life” or even something like “justification” you begin to see that while there are numerous verses which talk about saving something that can be lost, there is not a single verse in the Bible which talks about losing eternal life, losing everlasting life, or losing our justification. All of these gifts of God, once given, are never revoked or taken back.
There is no place in the Bible that talks about getting unjustified, unsealed, unregenerated, unindwelled, unbaptized by the Spirit, or any such thing.
If everlasting life can be lost, it has the wrong name.
Yes, I know there are difficult verses in the Bible, and troubling passages (Hebrews 6 and Hebrews 10 for example), but with a basic framework understanding of what Jesus teaches about eternal life being given freely to everyone and anyone who believes in Him for it, and that since Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners there is no sin that can take away the benefits of His death from us, and dozens of other Scriptures which talk about God’s infinite, unmerited, outrageous, scandalous grace, the clear teaching of Scripture seems to be that once God gives eternal life to someone, they have it eternally.
Yes, yes, there are people who might abuse this idea. Yes, there are people who think they have eternal life, but don’t. Yes, there are lots of false ideas out there about what eternal life is and how to get it. I am not talking about any of that. All I am saying is that according to Scripture, if a person has eternal life, then they have eternal life eternally. They shall never perish!
So do I believe in Once Saved, Always Saved? You tell me! What are your thoughts about the saying, “Once Saved, Always Saved”?
I appreciate you keeping the integrity of words, and not letting them be used flippantly. However, it’s not a trick question (as stated in first response), but a trick answer… Not saying you do this, but sometimes I think people get too caught up in the intellect and fail to meet people where they are.
Love your second response, especially the comment on Christ dying while we were sinners.
🙂
Consider Judas. Was he not Christ’s friend and chosen disciple? Our free will is God’s gift to us. At now time does He take this away. We can always decide that we don’t want God.
Yes, I believe in free will. But at the same time, I look at the way God has created families in the world. Our children cannot ever become “non-children” even if they change their name, never see their parents, and resolve to not think about mom and dad ever again. Once a child, always a child.
Matt and Jeremy – you each imply a quite different outcome if we exercise our free will and “decide we don’t want God”. Then what? What should a God of unconditional love do if we exercise this gift? And knowing that Jesus died for the sins of the whole world. It was enough. Blessings to you both!
So you were reading over my shoulder while I prepared my “detective story” introduction to Romans, eh?
Good stuff. Good stuff.
The problem I have with the idea that we can lose our salvation is there would be no possibility of any security. I know in my 35 years of following the Lord there have been times when I’ve walk close to the Lord, but other times when I’ve not. Have I walked away from God during these time or lost my salvation? Is my salvation dependent on my faithfulness to following Jesus? If so it’s very precarious. I could lose it every time I sin and I’m too stubborn or too deluded by my sin to repent. If this is the case I can never be secure.
Arminians have traditionally held the view that it is possible to lose your salvation, that our salvation is dependent on our moment by moment walk with the Lord. Calvinists aren’t much better. Although they are more likely to adopt the once saved always saved line based on predestination, they usually qualify it by saying ‘if you truly believe’ and the proof you have truly believed is if you continue to walk close to God! I had one friend who was bought up in a hyper-Calvinist church who had no security because he couldn’t be sure he was predestined!
As an aside, I find it fascinating that us Christians believe in truth, and yet we can all hold opposing views and yet claim our views are scriptural. I sometimes wonder why God allowed this. Why didn’t He just give us a theology book with every truth clearly laid out so there could be no difference of opinion, rather than give us a book full of stories, laws and letters that are open to interpretation? A theology book would have made things far more simple and may have stopped so many arguments and even bloodshed amongst those of us who claim to follow Jesus.
I do believe, as Matt shared above, that we have a free will and that some choose to reject God. In my walk with God I do fall, I sin daily, but I never confuse my sinful failures with my decision to abide in Christ. For me, sinning and rejecting God’s love and grace are not a package deal.
Paul,
Right. If there is no security in Jesus, there is no security at all. As long as we are looking in any way, shape, or form to our own faithfulness or good works as evidence or proof that we have eternal life (or as a way of earning or keeping eternal life), we will never have assurance.
Assurance is based 100% on what Jesus Christ has done for us through his life, death, and resurrection. Only in Jesus is there security. Thanks for the reminder on this!
I agree Paul. Too many opposing views. Everyone believes something different. I know how I believe. And I believe it is all going to work out. But I’ve decided that to tell everyone that what I believe was given to me by the Holy Spirit as opposed to what others believe is borderline presumption on my part and that in and of itself could be sin. I believe that Jesus loves everyone unconditionally and He is going to bring us all into perfect unity to the Father in the after life. In the meantime ALL I have to do is love Him and others as well as myself. Much of the madness of this world is due to religious terrorism (vs. Godly reverence) coming from of all religions. Yet, I am at peace with what I was taught to sing as a child, “He’s Got The Whole World in His Hands”.
I completely agree about the importance of understanding what it is we are being saved from. I personally think that Greg Boyd nailed it when answering this question. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkCMS8BJwGY
Thanks, Chuck! I will head over to watch that video.
Ok, so I watched the video. I like Greg Boyd A LOT, and agree with him most of the time, but I actually think this is one of his worst answers ever. Ha!
I think that he and Paul Eddy do not understand how the word “saved” is used in Scripture, and so this has muddled their thinking on this topic some. Of course, there are people who have the “get out of hell free card” mentality that they refer to, and I would not automatically offer assurance to such people either, but for completely different reasons than the fact their lives of full of gross immorality.
Anyway, this is one big issue I disagree with Greg Boyd pretty strongly on….
Ha! Oh well. 🙂
Paul Eddy clarified what is meant by “saved” in Scripture at about 4:25. You disagree with his definition then? How would you define it?
I guess I missed the part by Paul Eddy. I think he did a better job answering it than Greg did. I don’t have too much of an issue with the way he answered it. I think that 99% of the times the word “saved” (and derivatives) are used in Scripture, it has nothing to do with “escaping hell so you can go to heaven when you die.” I think Paul did a decent job explaining this.
Interestingly, I believe this to be a more emotional question. And probably a question that cannot be a answered with a few texts.
Mostly when one says that eternal life can be lost, one means when somebody decides to renounce his/her faith in Jesus. What should we call somebody who was a reborn Christian and now openly states to be a Atheist – saved or lost? To make things worse, imagine this new Atheist (formerly an evangelist for Christ) now to be a a radical evangelist for atheism. Jesus was talking to His own disciples in Matthew 10:33. I do know the standard answer for my aforementioned case, but I would not dare to say that the new Atheist never knew Jesus in the first place.
Do not get me wrong, I belief in eternal security! I belief that God promises this security. Nobody can snatch us away from that promise. But still, if somebody asked me about the Atheist I would read that beautiful promise in Romans 8:38, but at the same time I would say that the only thing not mentioned in that text is the person him/herself.
Jurgen,
Great points! I do try to hold my view with a strong dose of humility, for reasons just like the ones you have stated above.
I grew up with an Armenian view. I was “saved” more times than I can count from the time I was a little girl. I lived in constant fear of God, Hell, and myself. By the age of 12, I understood that God could talk to me from His Word and I could “hear” Him thru that and by use of prayer, I began to have amazing communion with Him! But, upbringing taught that once you were saved, you needed to go on to sanctification…a second work…where you became “perfect”. I had experienced a traumatic childhood, rife w/ abuse by one of these “saved” individuals. I witnessed “perfect” people making really bad choices and before they knew what had happened, they had “backslidden”…they NEVER saw it coming. Why? Because, they actually believed they could keep from sinning, so when they do, they have no idea where they “lost” their salvation! Absurd! By the age of around 16, the anger I held for them and and my view of God being in Heaven with a bolt of lightning aimed at me, made my choice easy. I decided that God was too hard to please. I saw Him as waiting to kick me out of Heaven at any infraction. My family would say these things weren’t sins, just weaknesses, but to me, everyone around me was dishonest about their own sins, let alone mine (Is 64:6) . So, I walked away. I had been taught that if you “walk”, you could be apostate/reprobate, so I lived in fear of going to Hell. But I truly wanted Jesus and believed He was the only way, but being perfect seemed impossible and He seemed scary. To most, it would’ve seemed I was lost and on my way to Hell. In fact, I couldn’t stand hypocrites (Matt 23:4), so I lived quite like I was lost. But there was a longing! And, looking back, He was speaking to me, watching over me, and directing my paths…even in my “yuck”, because ” if we are faithless, HE remains faithful! He cannot deny Himself!” ~ 2 Tim. 2:13. So, that is my answer to how someone can look like they are lost and not be! When people are claiming to be “saved” and don’t look anything like it, I do think it begs the question, “are they?”. I would’ve told you I wasn’t saved, based on my upbringing. But I believe He never let go! Now that I understand true security, I have a love for Him and a strong commitment to Him, that I know will take me through to the end, but not bc I’m good enough ;-). But, before I understood His unfailing commitment to me, I was so tossed about…fearful! “There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.” ~ I Jn 4:18. I have no reason to be afraid today! Praise God, I am no longer in bondage ~ Galatians 5! I now know that the “god” I walked away from, wasn’t the God of the Bible. It was a good thing that I realized I could never be perfect! He makes me able to stand before God one day, not on my own merit or good works but His perfect, eternal work! I understand that it is a complete trusting Him for what I cannot do myself! Some other verses worth noting: John 10:28 — if we could never perish, then how can true believers ever perish?
This is an age old debate amongst Christians. For those who see “Once saved always saved” as their guidepost in life it is often used as an excuse for not abiding in Christ. Often through the years when I’ve probed people who are living in sin and claim to be “back sliding”, they also believe in “Once saved always saved”. You have to ask yourself were they ever in the sheepfold? Living in the south, the culture of assembly line salvation has become quite cliched and efficient at turning out persons who claim Christ as savior and lord, and yet live like the world. Of course they believe in “Once saved always saved”. They have “fire insurance”.If you read some of the surveys on what christians in america believe, there is an aweful lot of confused people claiming the name of Christ.
Read the short article I have linked below of a once famous evangelist and associate of Billy Graham who renounced his faith in God. Lee Strobel interviewed him prior to his death, and his response to Strobel’s questions will be surprising.
https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/328-a-skeptic-reflects-upon-jesus-christ
Great points. I do not advocate the “fire insurance” view. I think there are compelling reasons to follow Jesus in the path of discipleship. Thanks for the article link. I will check it out.
By the way….don’t all persons that ever lived have everlasting life?
Hmm… in one sense yes (they will live forever) but not in the way that I think the New Testament uses the term.
The “once saved always saved” is yet another endless debate within Christianity.
My take is that each person should work out their own salvation with fear and trembling because who can truly know the mind of God?
From my experience, many who are anti- once saved always saved are lacking in love and grace and looking for a reason to condemn someone else to hell, or control them through fear and guilt.
Yes, you are right. There is a lot of legalism in this issues (on both sides of the debate). Sometimes those who argue most strongly for “grace” show the least amount of grace.
In responds to Ward Kelly, I would agree with the question “where they in the sheepfold?” I am not from your country, I am Dutch. In Holland it is not the custom of the people to call themselves ‘Christian’ (the ‘anti-Christian attitude is pretty’ strong here). This term is normally only used by people who are sincere with Jesus. In some cases there are unbelievers who refer to themselves as Christian, they are normally referred to as name-Christians.
The question “ones saved always saved” is just not easy to answer. The video posted by Chuck McKnight is a very good one. These guys do not give a definite yes or no, but urge people to take the promises or warnings serious.
Than the question “don’t all persons that ever lived have everlasting life?”
My answer: Yes, but the destination can be different.
Oh well, theology is not always straightforward… If it was we would not have to study as hard as we do 😉
Jurgen
Theology is fun, right?!
You are absolutely right that there are many people who refer to themselves as Christians but who are probably not.
Sure thing! Theology is fun and challenging. I think, together with law-studies, it is one of the broadest studies I know.
I noticed, when I visited the US, that not many people were ashamed of being called a ‘Christian’. I expect that to be a pain in explaining the Gospel to them. In the Netherlands however, people are not that keen on using the name ‘Christian’. “Are you a Christian?”, “Who, me? For goodness sake, no!”. That makes it easier to detect one’s conviction.
Yes, but I think this is sometimes because some who call themselves “Christian” are making a bad name for everyone else, and so to avoid the stereotype, some don’t call themselves “Christian” and call themselves something else, like “Jesus followers” or something like that.
DID JESUS TEACH “ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED”?
The apostles John was given direct messages from Jesus to relay to the seven churches. Was the message to the churches “once saved always saved”? No, it was not.
1. Revelation 2:1-5..the church in Ephesus…5 Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and the deeds you did first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.
Does that sound like once saved always saved?
Revelation 2:7 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will grant to eat of the tree of life which is in the Paradise of God.’
The tree of life is promised to him that overcomes. He was giving Christians that promise on the condition that they would repent. Jesus did not say once saved always saved.
2. Revelation 2:8–11 …the church in Smyrna…10…Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11…..He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.
These Christians were given a condition to receive the crown of life, be faithful until death.
Does that sound like once saved always saved?
3. Revelation 2:12-17…the church in Pergamum…14 But I have few things against you, because you have there some who hold the teaching of Balaam, who kept teaching Balak to put a stumbling block before the sons of Israel, to eat things sacrificed to idols and to commit acts of immorality……16 Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.17……To him who overcomes, to him I will give some of the hidden manna, and I will give him a white stone, and a new name written on the stone which no one knows but he who receives it.’
Christians need to repent of sinful lifestyles and beliefs. There is no doctrine of once saved always saved proclaimed by Jesus.
4. Revelation 2:18-29 …the church in Thyatria…20 But I have this against you, that you tolerate the woman Jezebel…21 I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality…….26 He who overcomes, and he who keeps My deeds until the end, to him I will give authority over all the nations;( SEE: Rev. 20:4-6)
Is is always he who overcomes. It is never he who is once saved always saved.
5. Revelation 3:1-6..the church in Sardis..3 So remember what you have received and heard; keep it, and repent. therefore if you do not wake up , I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I come to you. 4 But you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their garments; and they will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5. He who overcomes will be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels……
Some Christians will have their names erased from the book of life. The ones who will not have their names erased are those who repent of their sinful lifestyle and repent of the teachings that are contrary to God’s doctrines. He who overcomes will be saved, not he who is once saved always saved!
6. Revelation 3:7-13 …..11 I am coming quickly; hold fast what you have, so that no one will take your crown. 12 He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God…..
There are men who can talk you into relinquishing your crown. He who overcomes will not be in that number. Once saved always saved is just another teaching of false doctrine.
7. Revelation 3:14-22…16 So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth…. [ DOES THAT SOUND LIKE ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED?]….19 Those whom I love. I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent……….21 He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne….
There are no Scriptures that give Christians a license to sin. There is no Scriptures that says unrepentant Christians can live a sinful lifestyle, or teach doctrines contrary to the gospel of Christ and remain saved.
ONCE IN GRACE ALWAYS IN GRACE, IS A FALSE DOCTRINE!
WAS JESUS JUST GIVING EMPTY, FECKLESS WARNINGS TO THE SEVEN CHURCHES?
you are invited to follow my christian blog. Google search>>>> steve finnell a christian view
Obviously I have read, studied, and considered these texts. Note that throughout, Jesus is talking about “overcomers” not about “eternal life.” Be very careful that you don’t read “going to heaven when you die” or “having eternal life” into the phrase “He who overcomes.”
I know this was a pretty long time ago. But this verse gave me a lot of comfort and I hope it applies.
1 John 5:5 – Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
Absolutely! Thanks!
Steve
Why would you ignore the revelation Jesus gave to the Apostle Paul?
Jeremy as a reader of yours I love to watch the calm discussions of differing views.
What could be finer than discussion of our Saviour and His words?
That being said, on Osas you listed John 3:16. 5:24 .And 6:47, and Justin replied with 1 john 5:5 ,which you loved as though it made your case. The problem that I see with this discussion is that all of these in the KJB say “believeth” which means believe and continue to believe .
Seems pretty clear that continuation of belief is vital to salvation.
JLM,
There is a debate among Greek scholars as to whether the verb tense on these words means “believe once and done” or “believe and continue to believe forever.”
I side with those who see the “once and done” sort of view. In John 6, for example, Jesus uses the same verb tense for eating and drinking as He does for believing. Nobody eats/drinks and continues to eat/drink forever. When you sit down to eat or drink, you do it, and then you are done. Sure, you have a meal later, but you are not eating and drinking continuously between the meals.
Jhn 6:56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
Jeremy
Checked out John 6 / found this do we continue to dwell in him or just once and done?
little gun shy about recent Greek scholars some of them not even born again(self-proclaimed non-believing Greek scholars)
These weren’t recent Greek scholars who argue this way, but many and numerous traditional and “old time” Greek scholars as well.
Dwelling in Jesus isn’t once and done, but eating and drinking is. Again, all it shows is that you cannot place too much emphasis on Greek tenses.
that’s funny Jeremy how we can all read the same words and come up with totally different meanings. I would think that eating and drinking would be a continuous exercise. The moment you take your last drink or your last bite your life is essentially over . Also you understand that to go with any OSAS leanings you would have to go against all of the scholars from the King James Bible ( they chose believeth ) you would have to go with the critical scholars who have given us the recent Bibles , most of them seemingly totally inadequate. again thanks for your patience!
also if we’re looking into the Greek and it’s God’s inspired Word ,maybe we should be Very careful about the tenses
Dustin. .How about the actual fear that a loved one might be headed to hell with a false sense of security. I personally don’t want to control anyone, neither do I want to control anyone through fear or guilt ..however, wherever you land in eternity is forever ( no do overs)
I used to believe that once you die your fate is sealed i’am not sure I believe that now. Who is to say what God will do after someone dies. I have a hard time believing God’s grace ends when our hearts stop beating. Why would that be? I believe God is much bigger and our lifetimes here on earth are but a vapor to God in as far as time is concerned. If you think about it God exists outside of time, he holds time in the palm of his hand. He knows how short our life is here on earth. I think God knows that not every person will have an opportunity to hear about Christ in this lifetime or live a sinless lifestyle. This life is too short to for it to determine our eternal destiny I mean 80 to 100 years is nothing to God, yet our whole eternal destiny would depend on us making the right decision before we take our last breath? I don’t think God would operate that way, I have hope that people will have a 2nd chance after death, that is not competely unscriptural either.
Gladys what Scripture are you referring to? (The second chance scripture )
Their is a scripture in Peter (forget the exact chapter and verse) that states the Christ preached to the spirits in prison (i’am sure you have read it). What does that mean, Who are the spirits in prison?
I’am of the belief that God cannot contained in the bible and that their is more to God then what is just stated in the bible. We cannot know for what God will do after someone takes their last breath. I choose to believe and hope that God’s mercy extends even after our death.
To me the bible is a guideline, I don’t see it as an encylopedia of everything about God. I know I will ruffle feathers when I say this. I have been a Christian for 17 years, and though i read the word, I also seek God in spirit on my own. Their is no possible way that God being infiniate, omnipotent and omniscient can be contained in the bible. In some ways God’s ways are a mystery, it states that in the old testatment.
So based on that I don’t presume to know exactly how God will judge each person and whether or not this life is all we have to properly respond to God. To say that God’s mercy only extends to this life is ludicrous. We exist in time, God exists outside of time, he knows the beginning from the end and knows all things. I choose not limit God in his mercy, faithfulness, and lovingkindness. We can only get glimpses of God in this life in his word and in the quiet times we spend with him.
If a believer in Christ chooses to state aloud that they want nothing to do with God anymore because they do not understand that he is loving and believe that he is cruel because of some deception, but then later realize they are wrong can they be forgiven for renouncing Christ and if so then why did so many christians refuse to deny Christ even when faced with death and torture? If a person says the whole Trinity (including even the Holy Spirit) is evil, can they later change their mind and still find forgiveness for rejecting Him? It seems like even Jesus believed that speaking evil of the Holy Spirit was unforgivable, but maybe if a person was very hurt and confused there might be some exception?
Ahah this is funny because when you think about it you can think you are saved but you actually are not.. it’s possible. Maybe you do believe in Jesus and his saving power but one day you don’t believe anymore so people say you were never saved.. Well it’e easy to say know..
When you think about it really it boils down to this.
Once saved always saved is true because if you keep faith in our Lord and Savior until you die then you are saves so it was true once saved always saved. And if you fall and reject God then you were not saved to begin with so once saved always saved is still true..
Really there is no debating the issue..
Once you are saved you don’t do anything to stay saved. He keeps you.
Ephesians 1
13. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14. Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
Ephesians 4
30. And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Jude 1
Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ
So if you say God doesn’t exist then you are still saved ?
I think you missed my points.
Btw, Bible verses don’t prove anything..
If Bible verses don’t prove anything then what is the basis for your beliefs?
You do realize everything you read is interpreted by your brain given your experience and what you beliefs are and how you analyse the text..
So yeah a verse doesn’t prove anything, it’s the way you interpret a verse that gives you conclusions… 😉
So you can imagine i laughed when i saw you posted verses to prove your point. It doesn’t.
Tilùèn Kendhal says “You do realize everything you read is interpreted by your brain given your experience and what you beliefs are and how you analyse the text..
So yeah a verse doesn’t prove anything, it’s the way you interpret a verse that gives you conclusions…
So you can imagine i laughed when i saw you posted verses to prove your point. It doesn’t.”
Your brain misinterpreted my post. The Bible reveals everything we need to know about God and how we can know Him. Can the Bible be misinterpreted? Absolutely, which is why we must look at what the Bible says in its context and compared with other scripture. Otherwise you have no basis for what you believe.
Thank you! You have given answers to the question i have been pondering on. I’m still not sure which answer i accept as true, but i do know that if i repent daily and follow God’s word and seek his guidance in my life i won’t have to wonder where i stand with him.
If for no other reason than that “Once saved, always saved” can not be conclusively proven, it is a dangerous doctrine. Paul said that he pummeled his body to keep it under control so that he would not be disqualified. He encouraged us to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. So there seems to be enough evidence in scripture that we have some role to play in our salvation such as maintaining belief in the Son and the Father and being obedient. Jesus said that any one who keeps his word will never see death and “if you love me, keep my commandments”. I think our focus should be on loving God and doing what he wants us to do. I don’t think the Bible is trying to offer any assurance to those who merely want to profess belief in Christ but then make no effort to follow him. To tell people that all they have to do is accept Jesus into their heart and they will be saved forever no matter what is misleading and is potentially eternally fatal since it can lull people into a false sense of security. Our security comes from having a close relationship with God and abiding in him through faith and obedience.
Paul’s concern in 1 Corinthians 9 was not about losing his salvation, but being disqualified from the ministry. He didn’t pummel his body, but kept it under subjection. He didn’t say work for you salvation with fear and trembling, but work out your salvation with fear and trembling. He didn’t want the Philippian believers to be dependent on him (or any other man) all of the time. There comes a point when we must all grow and mature in the faith. All believers have the indwelling Holy Spirit. We should consistently assemble with the body of Christ, but there is a sense in which we must grow and mature. This is what he is talking about when he says “but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling”. No one is telling folks all they have to do is accept Jesus into their heart and they will be saved forever no matter what. When a person is saved they become a new creation in Christ Jesus so their life is going to change. To say a person can lose their salvation is to say what Jesus did on the cross is insufficient and is calling Jesus a liar since He said it is finished.
Lets’ see what the Bible says about a person who believes the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:3-4).
We are blessed with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ (Ephesians 1: 3)
Some of these blessing include:
Our sins are forgiven – Ephesians 1:7; Colossians 1:14 and 2:13, Galatians 1:4
We have peace with God – Romans 5:1
We have the righteousness of Christ imputed to us – 2 Corinthians 5:21
We are a new creature in Christ – 2 Corinthians 5:17
We are baptized into the body of Christ – 1 Corinthians 12:13
We are indwelt with the Holy Spirit – 1 Corinthians 6:19
We are sealed with the Spirit – Ephesians 1:13
We are sealed with the Spirit unto the day of redemption – Ephesians 4:30
We are preserved in Christ – Jude 1
We will be confirmed to the end by Christ – 1 Corinthians 1:8
We are citizens of the household of God – Ephesians 2:19
We are in the kingdom of God’s Son – Colossians 1:13
We are complete in Christ – Colossians 2:9-10
No, the context clearly shows that Paul is talking about salvation in 1 Cor. 9. Surely you don’t think he is promoting the idea that people can win an imperishable wreath by preaching. You may try to adjust the meaning of the words to make them fit your doctrinal bias but you will have to disregard the most elementary principles of hermeneutics.
My translation of ὑπωπιάζω is much closer to what Paul is attempting to convey than merely “keep under subjection”. Salvation was so important to him that he was willing to beat his body to make sure it didn’t do anything to cause him to lose his salvation. We should all be so fervent about guarding the precious gift we have been given. But even with your translation, you should be able to arrive at the conclusion Paul intended.
It’s not the preposition in Philippians that is key in the verse I correctly quoted but the verb “work”. That’s the point. There is work involved in salvation and as you work you grow and mature. You will see that if you read the Bible as a whole and not as a collection of proof texts.
One of the reasons, the doctrine we are discussing has been so difficult for people to resolve is that there is no agreement on what it really means to be saved. It is also difficult to know for certain if someone is saved because it depends so much on what is in their heart. People could say they believe in Jesus and what he did on the cross and really not believe it in their heart. Such a person would not be saved but we might not know that. So let’s start by trying to agree on what it means to be saved. Obviously, a whole book could be written on the topic and I’m sure many have, but let’s keep this simple and narrowed down to the topic of discussion and say that being saved means having been rescued from the wages of sin which is death. Our faith in Jesus Christ and his sacrifice for our sin enables us to be in a saved relationship with God and thus escape judgment wrath and eternal death. So, if we are saved when we die, we can look forward to an eternity of relationship with God in the beautiful place that has been prepared for us. Salvation is therefore very much about our relationship with God. If we have a relationship with him we are saved.
That part shouldn’t be too controversial though you might describe salvation in different terms. The real controversy swirls around the issue of whether we can lose our relationship with God and thereby forfeit salvation. I maintain that the Bible teaches that this can happen. There are far too many examples to catalog here but I will at least share one from Jesus himself in the parable of the sower. The seed that fell in certain types of ground and sprouted but then died refers to those who received the message and believed but then something happened to cause the young plant to die. This is a clear reference to those who believed the Gospel message and were saved, but did not maintain their relationship with God and therefore lost their salvation.
Now some people will argue, disingenuously I would say, that those people were never saved because they didn’t persevere. That is just begging the question. They did what they needed to do to become saved and they were growing in Christ until they stopped doing the necessary work to resist temptation and abide in him. Yes, it takes work to follow Christ’s commandments and abide in him, but I’ll address that further in response to the person below.
All of the verses you quote are true – none of them refute this view.
Martin it is not by works that we are saved but by grace that none should boast.Works do not get us us closer to God but good works come from a heart that loves God and desires to please him.John 3:16 is clear if we believe in Jesus Christ we shall have eternal life it is based not on what we do or have done but by the grace of God that has been poured out upon us because of Jesus Christ.God always gives us assurances or promises the condition to receive eternal life is to believe in Jesus Christ as the one who has saved from our sin.Personally i believe that the continued walk will determine our reward from the Lord again its not based on our effort but a trust or faith in God.This does not effect the gift of eternal life through Jesus Christ.
You are right that our works cannot save us and that we are saved by grace. If we do not accept the terms of God’s free gift of salvation, we cannot be saved no matter how many good works we do. You are also correct in your view that we will be rewarded for the works that we do if we are saved. It’s kind of like, you have to be there to claim the prize. The danger I am warning about is that people be so secure that their salvation is irrevocable that they fail to work it out with fear and trembling and end up losing it. I’m not sure why Christians have so much trepidation about the concept of work in salvation. James said that faith without works is dead. Dead faith will not get you into the Kingdom of God. People need to wake up and start seeing this.
Just because we believe in the importance of work in God’s kingdom (and that is found throughout the Bible), doesn’t mean that we believe that we are relying on the works to save us. We work because God told us to work and if we don’t we are disobedient and not faithful servants. You should know what Jesus says about them – they’re not saved.
I loved your John 6 refutation of Calvinism , but this must be an old old Calvinist posting. Shouldn’t you rewrite this? It’s eternally dangerous to teach the Calvinist innoculation.
I’m further responding to the statements you made above that there are “no scriptures about losing salvation, everlasting life” etc. You foolish Galatians , who has vexed you? You have fallen from grace, you have lost the faith, Christ has become of no value to you. I sure hope you’re not taking both sides of the issue to please your readers. Rick warren took both sides of the homosexual issue on videos. Also, I’ve partially scanned a point about 2 men in a bed one taken one left, and you stated you’re rethinking your view against homosexuality. I only glanced at the article, but I sure hope your not toying with people to get them to read your article.
I’m Believer to Jesus Christ but,I betray God to be famous, and now
I regent it and I”m worried that I lose my Salvation..I hate myself and I wish God didn’t chose me here in this Earth.
Is there someone you can talk to about this Newly?
Jeremy there is also the servant Jesus talked about in a parable who said (something like) “my master is taking a long Ng time to return” and he treated his fellow servants badly and Jesus said when the master returned that man would be treated as the unbelievers (and maybe worse)
1TIMOTHY CHAPTER 1 VERSE 20