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Job Problems (Tentative) Solution – Part II

By Jeremy Myers
9 Comments

Many peopleย have difficulties with how God treats Job in the opening chapters of the book of Job. I raised some of these questions is my opening post of of this series, and then last time, explained why I was asking these questions in the first place.ย Now I want to begin to propose a solution to this dilemma. This post contains some backgroundย premises that form the basis to my tentative solution. I will post the conclusion tomorrow.

Theย Background Premises

First, I do believe that the events described in the book of Job truly did happen in history. However, if you believe Job is simply a parable, a story of fiction to make a point, I won’t argue with you. However, since I also believe the Bible is inspired by God, even ifย Job is just a story, I still have to ask why Godย inspired the author to write the story in the first place.ย We stillย have to ask ourselves what the story saysย about how God deals with humans, and what is going on behind the scenes in some (but not all) of the tragedies and difficulties of human life. In a way, the author is trying to answer the question, “Why do bad things happen to good people?”

Second,ย I do believe (as some of the comments noted) that the book of Job is the earliest book of the Bible. It was probably written during the reign of King David or King Solomon, but had an oral tradition that went way back to before the time of Abraham. This is important because I believe (as I think Flo pointed out), that in a way, the entire rest of theย Bible was written to provide an answer for the questions raised by the book of Job. This means that if you have problems with how God treats Job, you are reading the book correctly! If you don’t have problems with how God treats Job, let me suggest you have a poor view of what kind of a God we worship!ย I believe the bookย is supposed raise questions about God and His dealings with His creation. And the answers to these questions are found in the rest of Scripture.

Third, one my favorite things to study is the historical/cultural background of the books of the Bible.ย  Reading Job from this perspective, it seems that the opening chapters of Job are like a call for champions from two warring tribes.ย In the Ancient Near East (ANE), sometimes battles could be fought and won simply by sending out a single champion from each opposing side to engage in mortal combat (remember David and Goliath?). Satan chooses the circumstances of life as his champion, and God chooses Job.ย The goal is to get Job to curse God. However, unlike such contests in the ANE, the victor of this battle does not gain mastery over the other (that contest comes later during the Satan vs. Jesus battle).

This battle theme permeates the entire Bible (e.g., see Eph 6:10-20). God is a God at War. This earth is the war zone. We are not here on planet earth as part of a vacation cruise throughย a cosmic wonderland, but instead find ourselvesย in theย middle of a battle betweenย two powerful enemies: God, the Creator of all, and Satan, who wants to be God. This is part of the reason we find so much wrong with our world.

Fourth,ย this war is not about us.ย Too much of our theology isย man-centered. I sometimes hear it taught that since God is love, and He is a relational God, He created us because He wanted to have a relationship with part of His creation.ย How egotistical and self-centered of us! I’m not saying God doesn’t want to have a relationship with us, but that is not the primary reason He created us. I’m sure I’ll get some people calling me a heretic for saying such a thing, but the fact of the matter is that as humans, we always want to put ourselves at the center of everything. Remember when the church taught that the earth was the center of the universe and the sun, moon and stars all orbited around us?ย Guess what?ย God doesย not orbit around us either.

I do not think God created us so thatย He could battle Satanย for our souls. That just seemsย foolish and petty.ย This battle is not about our souls, as if whoever gathers the most souls wins. Instead, I believe this war is about God trying to teach something to Satan and his angels. Satan, of course, is trying to prove God wrong. (By the way, isn’t it interesting that the created being in the universe who knows the most about God believes that God can be wrong and that God can be defeated? What does that say about Satan’s theology? What does it say about ours?) There are hints throughout Scripture that God created us to teach the angels (cf. 1 Pet 1:12). What are we teaching them? I have some speculative ideas, but I’m not getting into them here.

These four things are some preliminary ideas that helped form my tentative solution to the Job Problem, which I will post for your considerationย tomorrow.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Bible Study, Discipleship

Job Problems (Tentative) Solution – Part I

By Jeremy Myers
10 Comments

Thanks to everyone who participated in the discussion from the previous post. These comments, along with several email comments I received,ย have helped form my tentative solution over the next few days. This first post will simply provide some personal background for why I am asking these questions in the first place.

Autobiography

As you have probably guessed, my questions about the book of Job are not purely academic. Many times during the past year, my wife and I have literally yelledย to God, saying “We are not Job!” I dread waking up in the morning, becauseย it seems the first question that pops into my mind is “How is my life going to get shredded today?”

Someย people say, “Well, God must be disciplining you for something. Fix it, and life will get better.” Such people need to read the book of Job a little closer and see what God had to say about Job’s friends. Furthermore, people who believe that if you just “get right with God” then everything will be “peachy keen” are living in a fairytale land. In fact, if someones life is full of ease and comfort, I’d suggest that they are the ones who might need to “get right with God.” But I’m getting ahead of myself…

Not everyone is like Job’s friends. Many people have been telling us to “just focus on the positive things.” We tried that, but it seemed that just when we started focusing on something positive in our lives, it got taken away from us too. I also noticed thatย whenever I prayed for something, exactly the opposite happened. If I didn’t pray for something, but just hoped,ย things turned out as I hoped. It seemed that praying for something or focusing on something positive caused these things to become targets for God’sย heavenly pea-shooter.

I know that lots of people have gone through far worse than I have. And lots of well-meaning individuals tried to remind me of that not-so-encouraging fact. To the contrary, becoming aware of how terrible some people’s lives have turned only tends to surface the question, “What in the world is God doing?”

This question brought me back to the book of Job. As stated in my previous post, I have always hadย issues withย God’s treatment of Job in the book.ย The opening chapters of the book of Job remind me of the movie Trading Spaces where two rich, old men, in an attempt to answer theย “nature vs. nurture” debate, decide to gambleย with theย lives of two hapless victims for $1.

So in an attempt to figure out what God might be trying to do in my own life, I have been doing a lot of thinking about the book of Job,ย and the eventsย it describes. In my last post, I raised theย issue.ย I want toย propose a possible solution, but as I wrote it, it became too long toย publish in one blog post,ย soย I will spread it out overย the next couple days.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Bible Study, Discipleship

Job Problems

By Jeremy Myers
23 Comments

A Story

I was at the park over the weekend with my three daughters and we were playing on the swings. I noticed a man watching us play, and after a while, he came up to me and said, “It sure is obvious your girls love you.”

Thinking it was an odd thing for a stranger to say, I cautiously replied, “Thanks?”

He continued, “Aside fromย giving them fun things to do here at the park, I betย in this economy, you work hard to give them food, clothes, and aย roof over their heads.”

“Yep.” Now I was getting suspicious. “I try to provide for them the best I can.”

“Well, it’s obvious it is working. They adore you…”

I was starting to get a little upset. “I don’t give them that stuff toย earn their love, but because I already love them. What are you trying to say?”

“Well, I’m just saying thatย I bet theย only reason they love you is because you have provided so much for them. I bet they wouldn’t love you as much if you took some of that stuff away,” he said in a rather haughty tone. “I dare you to take some of that good stuff away and see if they still love you.”

Now I understood. And I was actually somewhat intrigued by the idea.”Okay,” I said. “Let’s try it. First, I’m going to not give them dinner tonight, and then tomorrow, when they wake up, all their clothes will be gone. When they come downstairs to ask my wife for clothes and food, we will be gone. When they come outside to see if we are working in the yard, I will have the house rigged so it burns to the ground. I’ll have some food sitting out there, but I’ll put something in so that when they eat it, they will get very, very sick. Then, I’ll send some neighbors over to tell them that their mommy and daddy did all this to them because they did something bad and we are angry with them. I am so sure they love me, that even through all this, I bet they will continue to love me.”ย 

“I bet they won’t,” he retorted.

“We’ll just have to see then, won’t we?”

Job Problems

Clearly, this story is fictional. I made it up, so don’t turn me in to CPS. Any parent who agrees to do these sorts of things to their children should have their children taken away from them. It’s monstrous, and it made me cringe just to write it. I cannot imagine doing anything so cruel to my three girls.

Which brings me to my Job problems. No, it is not problems with my job, but problems withย the premise of the Book of Job in the Bible. Have you ever read the opening chapters of the Book of Job? The opening chapters have God and Satan deciding to test Job’s love for God by taking away everything Job loves andย all he owns, and then have Job’s friends come and tell Job it is because God is punishing him.ย 

I’m not surprised thatย Satan suggests such a scheme. What surprises me is thatย God so readily agrees to it! And furthermore, God never tells Job why all this bad stuff happened to him.ย Jobย never finds out about this divine wager! God never tellsย Job that he was a pawn in a cosmic game of “chicken.” At the end of the book, when Job finally gets to ask God “Why?” God basically says, “I’m God and you’re not, so don’t question me.”

I understand that sometimes parents have to tell their children “Because I said so, that’s why!” or “Because I’m the parent!” butย such answers are not adequate explanations when the parent is abusing the child.

People say, “Yeah, but God gave it all back!” But would any court in the country allow me to keep my daughters if I treated them as described above, and then at the end of it all, say, “Just kidding! Here’s more clothes and food and a bigger house! Now let’s get back to being a happy family!” I don’t think so.

I am not trying to be irreverent or blasphemous, but I just have problems with how God treats Job. What am I not seeing? What am I not understanding?ย 

(I am working on a possible solution to this Job Problem, which I will post later, but I want to see what you come up with first.)

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Bible Study

Are you a Noun-Christian?

By Jeremy Myers
6 Comments

Christians often divide the world into two groups: Christians and non-Christians. But have you ever heard of a noun-Christian? It is the type of Christian who would rather talk about doctrine, theology, andย the meanings of various biblical words and passages without ever actually doing anything.ย It is the type of Christian I used to be, and the type of Christian I hung out with most.

As an example, we have allย sat through a missions conference where the emphasis of a sermonย was on the meaning of the word “Go” in Matthew 28:19,ย but the only call to action at the end of the message was to give more money when the plate was passed. I knowย I have preachedย semons like this before.ย If faith without works is useless (James 2), discussion without action is worse.

I recently came across the idea in Erwin McManus’ book An Unstoppable Force where he talks about this concept.ย He writes:

Biblical interpretation must be missiological, not theological. A theological construct for interpretation finds success in the attainment of knowledge. The more you know, the more mature a Christian you are thought to be. And yet knowledge of the Bible does not guarantee application of the Bible. To know is not necessarily to do. When the construct applied to the Bible is missiological, you engage the Bible to discover the response required of your life. It is significant that the history of the first-century church is called the book of Acts, not the books of Truths (p. 72).

Obedience to Scripture unlocks their mystery. …If the Bible doesn’t bring change, it is not being engaged (p. 85).

For too long we have focused on making sure people believe the right things and have left their concerns alone. I know it may sound like heresy, but it is more important to change what people care about than to change what they believe! You can believe without caring, but you can’t care without believing. We cannot afford to fill our churches with members who have biblical beliefs and worldly concerns (p. 111).

What does your church mean when it uses the word missions? It has always astonished me that so many churches and individuals who are ‘missions minded’ rarely engage in the mission of Christ that requires them to come face to face with an unbeliever and love that person into God’s kingdom (p. 125).

So what did you learn in church this past Sunday, or in your Bible reading today? Let me challenge you: if you were shown something you were supposed to do, and you haven’t yet done it, don’t read another chapter in your Bible or attend another church service until you have obeyed. God desires obedience, not faithful Bible reading and regular attendance at church (cf. 1 Sam 15:22).

If I ever pastor a church again, I would like to put the “service” back into “church service.” We would only gather at the church building every other week for the typical Sunday events. On the “off” weeks, we would go out as a group and put into practice what we learned the previous week. I am not sureย exactly how this would work,ย but it might be interesting to try. Who knows? Maybe we would find that service helped usย develop more as followers of Christ than singing and sermons ever did.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship, Theology of the Church

I Went to Church

By Jeremy Myers
14 Comments

I found the followingย articleย last year, and am posting it here. I have no idea who wrote it, or when.ย It appears to be written by a non-Christian, but for all I know, it could have been written by a disenfranchised Christian. But whoever wrote it, it says a lot of things that I think and feel, and so I am posting it. Whether youย like what is written below or not, please recognize that there are millions of people out there (both believers in Jesus and religious people) who empathize with what this person wrote. So here it is:

I went to church this Sunday; it was the first time in over a year and I was reminded once again why I will never be able to call myself a Christian. The people there were quite handsome, I’ll give them that. The building was beautiful, a masterpiece of architecture with a marble foyer and picturesque stained glass. There was greenery in every corner, which was about the only indication of life in the whole place. I sat on a very comfortable bench next to well-dressed people with plastic smiles full of bright white teeth.

The man in charge of music made us sing the same chorus over and over until everyone seemed to have convinced themselves that God was pleased, and then we all were told to greet one another. While an organ played some little diddy, a man extended his hand and asked me how I was, to which I replied, “Fine.” This happened three more times before I decided to tell the truth. “How are you this morning?” asked a perfect specimen of a young lady. “Horrible. Awful.” I replied. Her answer to my answer? “Well, praise God.” She never even heard me.

A few moments later a man approached the podium and talked about the great financial need of the church – apparently God was broke this weekend – and then he told us to give an offering as the Spirit led us. The Spirit didn’t say nothing to me so I didn’t give a dime when they passed the buckets – yes, an actual bucket – my way.

At this point it struck me that I had heard about the church, about money, about pastor so-and-so, but nobody had mentioned anything about Jesus. Seriously, not one word about their Christ. Oh, well, what did I care? I mean, after all, they were the Christians, not me.

Still holding out hope that the day would not be a wash, I listened to their preacher as he asked us to turn to the book called Matthew. He read about Jesus telling the disciples to not worry about anything because God would feed and clothe them. Nothing wrong with that in my book. For the next fifteen minutes he told me and the other 500 plus people that everything was good, and not only good, but getting better. He told me not to judge anyone because they weren’t to judge me.

His big thought of the day was that we ought to take a meal to whoever was our next door neighbor and tell them that Jesus cares for them and so does the church. Hmmmmm. My neighbor’s name is Russ and he is heavily tattooed, curses like a sailor, and beats his wife every other weekend after sucking down a bottle of Jack Daniels. Somehow I didn’t think that fried chicken, apple pie, and a hugs-and-kisses message from Jesus was really going to impact him so I chose not to take the preacher’s advice.

At the end of his little chat, we all bowed our heads and reminded ourselves of how good God is, how good we are, and how good it is to be good. Funny…in spit of being reminded how grand is my state of being, I left feeling rather bad.

Actually, it didn’t even rise to level of bad, it was the saturation of nothingness… irrelevance… and needlessness. I wondered if anyone else had caught this bug during the last hour or waste. What would have made the difference? I’m really not sure. Maybe a tear, maybe a glitch in the flow of the ultra-smooth program, maybe a torn page in the hymn book to let me know that imperfections were allowed in this church. I mean, the babies didn’t even cry, for goodness sake. Maybe a preacher with less of an ego and more of a soul might have helped.

I don’t know; I honestly went there hoping to find this Jesus that my friend tells me I so desperately need. All I found was a group of mannequins who resemble a Hollywood cast party more than a group of people with an in-road to God. I’ll take Jesus any day that I can find him, but you can keep your Christianity. I mean, I can find insignificance in life without God and His polished posse.

I may not be a Christian, but I can tell you one thing, the only time I know of that Jesus went to a place of worship like the one I attended last Sunday, it is my understanding that he turned over their tables, called them thieves, and ran them all out so that they could think about what the house of God was really supposed to be. Maybe if I had seen that from someone this past Sunday, Christianity would be more appealing.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Theology of Jesus, Theology of the Church

Biblical Languages

By Jeremy Myers
8 Comments

Now that I have been out of Seminary for about four months, I am beginning to get some perspective on what I learnedย and how useful it is for life and ministry. I am sure this perspective will continue to mature and develop, butย below is something my wife and I were talking about the other day…

Most seminary programs place a high emphasis on learning the Biblical languages of Greek and Hebrew. The theory is that knowing Greek and Hebrew will aid the student in understanding the text better, and therefore, being able to teach it better. It is for this reason I studied them, even though learning languages has always been a struggle for me. In seminary, I easily spent just as much time on my Hebrew and Greek classes as I did on all my other classes combined. On an average night, I would spend 4-6 hours on homework, and usually, 3-4 of these were on learning Greek or Hebrew.

The question for me now is whether knowing such languages will actually proveย helpful for understanding the Biblical text? I think to some degree it has. But given the wide variety of good English translations, the vast availability of Greek and Hebrew study tools (both in book and digital format), and the large number of good commentaries that have been written, I expect thatย knowing Greek and Hebrew is not going to beย super beneficialย to me personally. I will most likely use it in my studies, but one thing learning Greek and Hebrew taught me is that unless you are an expert, using Greek and Hebrew is rather dangerous. Since I will never be a Greek and Hebrew expert, I must tread lightly when using the languages in my study.

One other thing I have become convinced of in using Greek and Hebrew is that aย pastor must almost never use Greek and Hebrew in his publicย teaching. This gives the impression to those listening that unless they know Greek and Hebrew, they cannot truly understand Scripture. Today, Greek and Hebrew is like Latin was in the Middle Ages. They are the languages of the Bible scholars and have effectively taken the Bible out of the hands of the “laity,” requiring them to go to the trained “clergy” for proper interpretation.ย The teacher or pastor who frequently says “…now in the Greek (or Hebrew)…” is taking the Bible away from the people.

I do, of course, think that language studies should be a part of every seminary education. However, if I am looking to be a better teacher of Scripture, I think that languages like Spanish, Chinese, and Hindi might be better than Greek and Hebrew. If one purpose of seminary is to help prepareย students to “go into all the world and preach the gospel” it seems that learning the languages of “all the world” might better prepare us to do that then learning dead languages that nobody speaks any longer.

What do you think?

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship

New Favorite Music

By Jeremy Myers
14 Comments

Here is the timelineย for my music-listening preferences:

Birth-Jr. High: Only Christian music
Jr. High-High School: Mostly “Secular” music
College-Pastoral Ministry: Mostly Christian music, Some country music
2005-2008: No music at all
June 2008-Present: Mostly Secular music

Generally, when I made the switch from Christian to secular music, it was because the Christian musicย sounded so fake and empty. Most Christian music seemed to be aboutย happy feelings and happy lives and how great God is and how awesome is His name. Also, there were those breathless love songs to Jesus, which always made me squirm. Oh, and theย songs about fountains and tides of blood, creeped me out a bit. So I would switch to “secular” music where people sang about the issues and feelings I was actually dealing with in my mind, heart, and life.

But then some Christianย would come along and tell me that “secular” music was evil, and I needed to repent and only listen to Godly music which didn’t tempt me to sleep around, take drugs, and kill cops. So I would trash all my secular albums, and go back to the Christian stuff.

Finally, about three years ago, I just gave it all up. I couldn’t, as a “good Christian,” listen to the secular stuff, and for the most part, I didn’t like listening to the Christian stuff. So I just didn’t listen to anything.

Then I read some books and talked with some people (like my pastor, Stephen Hammond) and realized that there should be no real division between “sacred” and “secular.” This is an artificial, man-made division to help some Christians feel self-righteous and holier-than-thou. Anything that is well done, whether music, art, cooking, or working, is a testimony to the goodness and creativity of God.

So I started listening to secular music again, and realized why I enjoyed it so much. Christian artists (with the exception of groups like Casting Crowns) seem to suffer from the illusion that since God is so great, when we come to Jesus, life becomes grand andย all ourย problems disappear.ย Everybody knows this is hogwash, but nobody wants to admit it.ย “Secular” artists do not try to hide the fact that this world and all our relationships are messed up. Instead, they lay things out the way they are, and often, they dream about something better, about the way things could be…if only things were different.

As an example, check out the lyrics to one my current favorite songs. It’s from the song by Nickelback called “Savin’ Me”

Prison gates won’t open up for me
On these hands and knees I’m crawlin’
Oh, I reach for you
Well I’m terrified of these four walls
These iron bars can’t hold my soul in
All I need is you
Come please I’m callin’
And oh I scream for you
Hurry I’m fallin’, I’m fallin’

Chorus: Show me what it’s like
To be the last one standing
And teach me wrong from right
And I’ll show you what I can be
Say it for me
Say it to me
And I’ll leave this life behind me
Say it if it’s worth saving me

Heaven’s gates won’t open up for me
With these broken wings I’m fallin’
And all I see is you
These city walls ain’t got no love for me
I’m on the ledge of the eighteenth story
And oh I scream for you
Come please I’m callin’
And all I need from you
Hurry I’m fallin’, I’m fallin’

Also from Nickleback, hereย are the lyrics from their songย entitled “If Everyone Cared”:

And as we lie beneath the stars
We realize how small we are
If they could love like you and me
Imagine what the world could be.

If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we’d see the day when nobody died
When nobody died…

These lyrics are not exactly perfect in their theology, but who says they should be? What they reveal is a heart longing for forgiveness, redemption, and a world set straight. Such songs create amazing bridges with other people to talk about what Jesus offers the world.

So the next time you are in your car driving to work or the grocery store, try flipping to a “secular” station. As you listen to what they are singing about, you will begin to learn and understand what people are feeling and longing for. See if your heart doesn’t begin to break.

P.S. I have also recently enjoyed songs by Coldplay (“Viva la Vida”)ย and The Fray (“How to Save a Life”). If you know other songs I might like, mention them in the comments below.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship

Church Marooned

By Jeremy Myers
5 Comments

As I drive around Dallas with my job, I get to see a lot of churches. Dallas, in case you didn’t know, is the mega-church capital of the world. There are more mega-churches here than in any other place in the world. One street I drove down the other dayย had four mega-churches within half a mile,ย two on each side of the road. Of course, in a town with lots of mega-churches, there are also a lot of non-mega-churches. So there are a lot of churches.

But whether a church is mega or not, I love to read the “signage.” I’m not only talking about the reader boards in the parking lot, the banners draped across the buildings, and the posters plastered along the fence, but also the way the building and grounds are kept and maintained. All of these things say something to the person driving by, and I often try to imagineย how these things are perceived by someone who is not a Christian.

I’ve come toย believe that most of us Christians are marooned on an island. We have so cut ourselves off from the world, that we have become isolated. And what happens to someone who becomes isolated from everybody else? Like Tom Hanks in Cast Away, people who are inย isolationย start talking to themselves.

I think the same thing has happened to most churches. Most church buildings, in my opinion, are designed for the people who already attend there, not for the people who do not yet attend. We’re talking to ourselves. Most sermon series and Vacation Bible School ideas seem to beย designed for people who already know the Bible and want to follow it. Even churches that try to be “seeker friendly” come across as somewhat disconnected from reality to the average Joe and Mary.

Try this little experiment to see for yourself:ย As you pull up into your church parking lot tomorrow morning, try to absolutely clear your mind of everythingย you know about God, the Bible, church, Christianity, and Sunday Services. Try to put yourself in the mind frame of some guy who was out drinking beers with his buddies last night, and is coming to church just to appease his wife. He knows nothing about God or the Bible, nor does he really want to know. Instead, he’d like to be home putting more beer in the fridge so he has plenty for the football game.ย 

How does this guy view your church building? How does he view all the people at the door who want to shake his hand, but nobody else in church really seems to care that he’s there…except the pastor, who just came up and hugged him? On the other hand, does he really want people to know he’s there? What does he think about the music, with people waving their arms and crying? And what about that prayer time, with all the requests for God to “bless the outreach” (what is outreach?) and “be with Joe” (How is that going to happen?). Then comes the sermon, with Pastor Hug-a-Lot talking about how God wants to hug you and wipe away your tears. Finally, the “service” (though no one really served anything) ends with passing a plate for tips and everybody holding hands while the pastor “sends them out into the world.”

I know that all of this is a bit of an exaggeration,ย but the truth is that most churches are like alien worlds to most non-Christians. Even if you go to a church where the service is “primarily for believers” the average Christian in your churchย  probablyย speaks and behavesย rather strangely for the average non-Christian. Many Christians probably think this is what it means to be “in the world but not of it” but I tend to think most of our behavior is neither in the world nor of it. Nobody, as far as I can tell from the Gospels, ever rolled their eyes at Jesus. Instead, everybody (except for the religious people) wanted to hang out with Him.

I think we can have that effect on people too…but we are first going to have to make sure we are “in the world.” And the only way I know of to do that is to begin makingย genuine friendships with people who are not of our church, not for theย purpose of converting them, but just to be friends.ย Unless and until we do this, weย will probably find it next to impossible to see church through their eyes and hear what is said through their ears. Until this happens, we’re marooned on an island, talking to ourselves.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship

Belonging before Believing

By Jeremy Myers
5 Comments

Sorry for the lack of posts recently. I worked 75 hours last week. Whew! Thankfully, I got off early today, so I have time to write a blog post, and (more importantly) spend time with my wife and three girls!

Inย a previous post, Randy Siever made the following comment:

St. Patrick seemed to accomplish this by allowing outsiders to be part of his community life. This was not the usual way the church did evangelism, but he allowed people to belong before they believed. He just went into an area and considered everybody โ€œinโ€. You had to opt out to not be part of his community (this is where the โ€œparishโ€™ idea got developed into itโ€™s modern understanding, and historically why some areas of the US still refer to geographic areas of their cities as โ€œparishesโ€โ€ฆif you live there, youโ€™re part of the parish.)

What would a church look like if that were the strategy? What would evangelism look like if people could actually belong before they believed? I donโ€™t really have many answers here, just questions. But I think we have much to learn from our fathers before us when it comes to this kind of issue.

This is exactly right and where I see myself headed as a pastor church planter carpet cleaner…or whatever.

Belong Before Believe
At a recent Glocalnet church planting conference, Bob Roberts talked about how churches are generally made up of three things: Believing, Belonging, and Blessing. In other words, they focus on doctrine, fellowship, and service. The typical church requires that a person believes the same way they do before they will allow that person to feel accepted in their fellowship or to get involved with service in and through the church. They require belief as a prerequisite to belonging and blessing.

Bob Roberts suggested that the biblical model, and true discipleship, allows people to enter into “church life” through any of the three areas (Note that “church life” is NOT to be equated with “eternal life.”) So in this way, if a person longs to be part of the close-knit fellowship of the church, or join the church in building homes in the community,ย they can do so without signing a doctrinal statement.ย Discipleship churches allow people to belong or be a blessing without first believing.

Bounded Sets and Centered Sets
I ran into the same idea in The Shaping of Things to Come by Frost and Hirschย in which they talked about Boundedย Sets andย Centered Sets. Most churches are Bounded Sets, where there is a set of guidelines and rules (doctrinal, behavioral, political, etc) and everybody who agrees with those guidelines are allowed “in” and those who do not, are kept outside until they conform. A Bounded Set is like a fence which separates tame horses from the wild ones. The fence keeps the tame ones together, controlled, and countable.

Frost and Hirsch go on to recommend moving to a Centered Set. In a Centered Set, there are no boundaries, but only those who are closer to the center than others. Those who are closest to the centerย areย involved and active.ย The center in “church life” of course, must be Jesus and following Him. Anybody can be part of a Centered Set as long as they want to live like Jesus, love like Jesus, and learn from Jesus. (Again, remember that “church life” is not to be confused with “eternal life.”) They don’t have to believe just like you do, or behave just like you do to belong to your fellowship or join with you in blessing the community. Following the agricultural imagery,ย think of aย Centered Setย as a watering hole in an arid wilderness. Ranchers in such areas know that they don’t need fences and barns. All they need isย a well or a spring, and the livestock will not wander more than a one day walk from the water.ย  Some live and remain right on the edge of the water, while others may only visit once a day. In such a set, there is much less control, oversight, and expense.

I really think this paradigm shift could really help many churches become more missional in what they do and how they interact with others who don’t agree with them doctrinally. For more on this topic, here are some links:

Next Reformationย 
John W. Morehead

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship, Theology of the Church

Are House Churches the Answer?

By Jeremy Myers
11 Comments

I attended a House Church Conference this past weekend. It didn’t take me long to realize that “house churches” are not the answer to the current problems with Christianity in Western culture. But before my house church friends jump on me, let me say that mega churches are not the answer either. Nor are emerging churches, traditional churches, contemporary churches, family churches, bible churches, denominational churches, independent churches, or any other kind of label you might want to put in front of “churches.”

Though Barna reports that the house church movement in Western Christianity is multiplying rapidly (somewhere betweenย 5-20 million people in the United States attend a house church), the statistics also show that the vast majority of these house church membersย transferred fromย an “institutional”ย church to a house church. For the most part, they are not new believers.

I do not call that success. I do not call that growth.

Certainly, some of these transplanted Christians may find deeper intimacy and fellowship with God and with other believers in their new circle of friends, but unless they are also finding ways to love, serve, and become friends with people who are not Christians, all they have done is substituted one form of Christian consumerism for another.

The bottom line is this: I don’t care what kind of church you attend, when you meet, how often you meet, what kind of songs you sing, how long your prayers are, what the building looks like, what kind of teaching there is, who teaches, or (to a certain extent) what your theological framework is. If you and your church are not loving, serving, spending time, and developing friendships with people who do not attend your church (and who may never come!), you are not acting as the Body of Christ.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Discipleship, Theology of the Church

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