I have a friend who wants to plant churches. He doesn’t want to raise support, but to support himself bi-vocationally. Also, he wants to reach those people that most churches don’t (or won’t) reach. He figures that just as Christ came into this sin-sloshed world to save us, he needs to go into a sin-sloshed place to reach the unreached people of our culture. I can’t disagree on any of this.
But then he told me what he wants to do as his bi-vocational job: He wants to tend bars. He figures that pastors and bar-tenders have a lot in common.
He may be right about that, but does that make it right?
Oh, and by the way, his wife wants to have a ministry with strippers. She wants to go into strip clubs with a female friend of hers, and befriend the girls in there. If necessary, she says she will buy lap dances, but rather than get a lap dance, use the time to express the love of Jesus to them. She wants to have them over for dinner, and give them birthday parties, and teach them how to manage a budget, and cook meals, and care for babies.
Is it okay for a Christian pastor to be a bartender and for his wife to enter strip clubs?
Is this kind of outreach and evangelism “legal” for Christians? Or, maybe more Christians should be doing this kind of thing, and the only reason we aren’t is because we’re afraid of what “legalistic” Christians will say.
What do you think?
Update: After I wrote this post, I discovered some groups that were doing exactly these things.
Absolutely! Yes, this is where we should all be! “Go into all the world and preach the Good News to everyone, everywhere.” Mark 16:15 It is the unbelievers that need to hear the Word…not just the believers…they already believe! Yes, if we want to live like Jesus…which ultimately is what we are “saying” we want to do by becoming “Christians”…the we need to reach the “untouchables”. Jesus didn’t just sit in a building waiting for people to come to him…he went to them…wherever they were. Prior to all the “church” buildings…The early church was referred to as “The Way”. Your friends are living “The Way” Jesus did. Christianity is a man-made term. I believe God would rather we reach the unbelievers than worry about what “legalistic Christians” will say. I minister online to young people all over the world who have been involved in drinking, drugs, cutting, dancing for livings, etc. but I think physically going into these worlds to reach these people is what Jesus would want us to do! I applaud your friends….a standing ovation…let us all spread this passion!
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I don’t see why a pastor couldn’t also be a bartender. Unless of course, his particular sect believed that drinking is a sin. Then there’s a conflict. I don’t know if people still believe this. Being in New Orleans, I don’t know people in any denomination that still preach that drinking is a sin. Of course, where would I likely encounter such people? We probably wouldn’t travel in the same circles. 🙂 If he’s planning on evangelizing while tending bar, he better find an understanding and complicit employer or open his own place.
The stripper ministry is a little weird. Ultimately, this woman would be going to someone’s place of employment and asking them to give up their job. Sure, her money is as good as anyone else’s, but the lap dance is merely the sales pitch for the VIP room. So even if she paid them for the song, she’s still disrupting their flow of income (unless of course, she’s planning to spend serious money). And how much ministering can you do in a loud, smoky bar in three minutes? I can imagine that after a few trips she would be persona non grata. In such an environment, that could get her hurt.
It is interesting, though.
It sounds like the work that they propose to do is exactly “what Jesus would do.” I wish them many blessings.
Peace.
Jeremy,
I think there is a difference between going to where sinners do their sinning and ministering to sinners.
I don’t recollect, correct me if I am wrong, Jesus going to the places where sinners did their sinning.
1 Thes 5:22
Abstain from all appearance of evil.
I am sure that through prayer and thinking you could come up with ways on how to reach those you wish to target without appearance of impropriety of any kind.
Antonio
Hi bro. Jeremy. God Bless you.
Bro. Antonio,
So well-said brother. I knew this was true, but could not think of how to put it in a concise way as you have done. This is an issue we all should wrestle with, but you have done it in a way that is true to the whole Word of God without having to stretch it to make it appear that Jesus “hung out” with sinners as is somtimes implied. He loves sinners thank the Lord since I am one! But He is holy also, thank the Lord again since only a holy Savior can save sinners & make us holy as well.
Paul does advise the church to avoid appearing evil, but Jesus was called a drunkard and a glutton for drinking and eating with sinners, and did not stop his actions because of the rumours his critics spread. If you do not go to where the sinners are sinning, where are you going to find them?
I’m not certain if these are the best ways in which to minister, but God has surprised me in the past. I also would not have guessed that marching around a walled city, blowing horns, would be the best way to bring the walls down. If it is God who has called them to this ministry, then God will minister through them.
I read a story once about a man who was speaking to a member of the clergy and said, “I’m not sure if I’m comfortable telling my problems to a pastor.” And the cleric reached into his inside jacket pocket, pulled out a flask, poured some scotch into a glass and handed it to the man.
“Then tell them to your bartender,” he replied.
It’s a fictional story, and I hope it’s clear that the pastor was referring to himself in his reply. In a world where people see pastors as people they can’t talk to because the pastors are ‘holy’, separate, and thus would not understand, different sorts of approaches are sometimes needed.
Quester,
You wrote, “If you do not go to where the sinners are sinning, where are you going to find them?”
That is right on target! Too many of us Christians, when we say, “avoid all appearance of evil” we mean “avoid all non-Christians except those who are willing to live according to our standards of morality.”
And as you so well pointed out, Jesus himself did not “avoid all appearance of evil” since He was accused of being a glutton and a drunkard. Jesus was willing to risk His reputation and his life in order to be with sinners where they are at.
So what does Paul mean in 1 Thess 5:22? Antonio has unfortunately quoted from the KJV, which is a very poor translation of that verse (See TDNT, 2:375). The verse is not properly translated “avoid the appearance of evil” but rather “avoid every form or manner of evil.” In other words, “Don’t sin.”
So the real issue here is, “Is serving alcoholic beverages sinful?”
I wonder why you wouldn’t address me, Jeremy. That is odd. I am part of the problem you are speaking out against? I hope not. I have always been for you and not against you.
Antonio,
I was just commenting on two comments in one comment to save time. I’ve only encountered one person in the blog world who thinks such a practice is odd and since you are not him, I didn’t think you would mind. Sorry!
So, here it is:
Antonio, your use of 1 Thess 5:22 may not be the best way to understand that verse. You quoted from the KJV, which is a very poor translation of that verse (See TDNT, 2:375). The verse is not properly translated “avoid the appearance of evil” but rather “avoid every form or manner of evil.” In other words, “Don’t sin.”
I think the bi-vocational pastor is fine in his choice of the alternate vocation. He’s neither sinning nor causing others to sin.
If anything the whole stripper ministry thing bothers me a little more. I’ll have to put some thought into why that is.
Yeah, but aren’t we causing them to sin if they’re getting intoxicated by what we’re serving them?
I think that would be cool
Yeah, I kind of think so too.
My dad went to church maybe 3 times a year and felt uncomfortable. He went to bars on Fri. and Sat. He was at home there. He had friends there that edified him to always do good like Wesley. The bar was his church so there is a perfect place for a minister and/or clergy. I’m not so high on the strip club however.
This is fine. Luke 19:10 tells that Christ came to seek and save but not so that we walk over to HIM. We need to seek the lost from their locations!
Jesus DID turn water into wine..:) Definitely in opinion a heart issue.
Ha! Yep.
What does Love tell you/us? 🙂
I believe that what his wife is proposing is absolutely okay and even biblical. But I do not believe the “pastor” should work as a bartender.
Many would have trouble with what his wife proposed as well, including giving the money to the girls. They see it as supporting their lifestyle.
I was a bartender at a curling club in Canada for a season. Mostly its people in their 50s drinking wine, beer, or Bloody Mary’s after the game. But then once we had a tournament with a bunch of young Scots. They got so drunk I remember one guy was crawling on the ground yelling, “I’m too drunk to see! I’m too drunk to see!” He was typical of the whole rowdy group. I quit the next day. Serving people a drink is one thing. Helping people get drunk is another thing entirely.
Wow. Funny story, though! And you gotta love the Scots!
Why not?