I taught recently on Luke 2:40-52 and indicated in my message that Jesus learned the Scriptures and learned wisdom just like any human. Just as He grew physically, He also had to grow in knowledge, wisdom, and spiritual strength.
That Jesus learned seems pretty clear from verses like Luke 2:40 and 52 where it says that Jesus grew in wisdom and stature and in favor with God and men. You can see an old version of a sermon I taught on Luke 2:40-52 here.
I also pointed out in that message that when Jesus went to Jerusalem at the age of 12 with his parents, He went to the Temple and listened to what was being taught and asked questions (Luke 2:46). Finally, I mentioned Hebrews 5:8 which indicated that Jesus learned obedience through what He suffered.
After the study concluded, I had several people challenge me on the idea that Jesus had to learn anything. They argued that since Jesus was God, He knew everything, even from birth, and so didn’t have to learn from His parents, from reading Scripture, or from anybody at the Temple in Jerusalem.
Such an idea shocked me. I have never heard such a thing before. Have you?
Did Jesus Learn?
I asked if Jesus knew how to speak all languages when He was an infant, and was told that yes, He did. He didn’t have to learn how to talk, but that He “hid” His ability until it was normal and natural for a child to speak. They said that His parents didn’t teach Him anything about the Scriptures and that He never had to attend school or a Jewish synagogue to learn how to read or to learn what the Scriptures said. Because He was God in the flesh, He just knew it.
When I pointed out that Luke 2:40 and 52 says that Jesus grew in wisdom, they said that this just meant that Jesus became known for His wisdom, as is indicated in Luke 2:47.
I told them that to me, this sounds a lot like the ancient Gnostic and Docetic heresies which taught that Jesus wasn’t fully human. After all, isn’t learning, growing, and developing in knowledge and wisdom a central element to being human?
If Jesus didn’t have to learn, then isn’t He just like some sort of divine Buddha child that falls out of heaven, who has all wisdom and knowledge from birth? If Jesus didn’t have to learn, then why did Jesus have to wait until He was 30 to begin His ministry? If Jesus didn’t have to learn, then how can He truly understand what it is like to be human?
At one point in our discussion, I said, “Well, it seems logical that if Jesus was fully human, then He had to learn.” Their response was, “I don’t use logic. I just use Scripture.” I just about broke out laughing. It seemed pretty obvious to me that logic was not being used. Ha! One guy also kept saying, “I don’t speculate about Scripture. I just believe what it says.” This is the old “The Bible says it; I believe it; that settles it” cliche which I wrote about a while back. People like to believe that they are just believing the Bible, but they don’t. I don’t either. We believe what we think the Bible teaches. Some of what we believe is truly what the Bible says, ans some of what we believe is a misunderstanding of what the Bible says. The trick is knowing which is which…
This group also strongly objected to the idea that Jesus might have attended a Jewish synagogue as He was growing up, and also later in life. I pointed out that Luke 4:16 pretty clearly indicates that Jesus had a tradition of attending the synagogue, which probably went back even into His childhood. They said, “Well, even if He did go, He didn’t go to learn anything. Even if you are right that Jesus had to learn, there was nothing He could learn from them.”
“From who?” I asked. “The Jews?”
“Right. Jesus wouldn’t learn anything from Jews.”
“…You do know Jesus was Jewish, right?” I asked.
They responded that they did know this, and we moved on to other topics, but it seemed to me that this was another one of those old mistakes (championed by Marcion who ended up discarding most of the Hebrew Scriptures) where some Christians try to separate Jesus and the apostles from anything Jewish. I believe that such a move causes us to misunderstand most of what Jesus, Paul, and Peter teach. But I digress….
I think Jesus did learn. I think learning is a major element of being human. I think that Scripture pretty clearly indicates that Jesus grew physically, mentally, and spiritually (Luke 2:40, 52). Note that something nearly identical is said of John the Baptist in Luke 1:80. So however a person understand Jesus’ learning (or lack of learning) in Luke 2:40, 52, this same idea must be applied to John in Luke 1:80.
But what do you think? Did Jesus learn? However you answer, what Scriptures and logical arguments would you use to defend your position?
On a related note, here is a much harder question: If you think Jesus did have to learn, when do you think Jesus knew He was God incarnate? When do you think He realized He was the promised Messiah?
Below is a video where NT Wright addresses this question a bit, and for you scholarly types, here is an article he wrote on the topic: Did Jesus Know He was God? And for you super scholarly types, I recommend Wright’s book, Jesus and Victory of God.
Learn? Well yes – I think that Hebrews answers this directly. He learned obedience through what he suffered. The Salkinson Ginsberg translation into Hebrew give what to me is a difficult translation even suggesting that there is a voice of mitsvah in the implication. They do use LMD for learn – (= talmud).
וְאַף בִּהְיוֹתוֹ בֵן לֻמַּד בְּסִבְלֹתָיו לִשְׁמֹעַ בְּקוֹל מְצַוֶּה –
but even though he was a son, he learned through his suffering to listen to the voice of command
בְּסִבְלֹתָיו = lit. burdens-bearing – an interesting choice of gloss
Good points. He did learn in the way also.
JESUS set aside His Glory as part of the Godhead and was born a human being! John 1:14 Philippians 2:5-8. This is why JESUS Himself Referred to Himself as the Son of Man! JESUS walked the earth as a Man filled with the Holy Ghost as an Example for us to pattern our lives! Acts 10:38. Luke. 4:1 & 18. John 14:12. We as the sons of God need to Study how to Rightly divide the WORD of Truth: For there are Many Denominational Doctrines, Traditions of men and Doctrines of demons that Water down the WORD of GOD Rendering it weak and powerless!!!!!
Right, “as an Example for us to pattern our lives ” 1 Peter 2:21.
I’ve run into that same argument, and like you, I am quite convinced that Jesus had to learn just as we do. It is interesting to note how he describes his relationship with the Father: “I only say what I hear from the Father…. I only do what I see the Father doing.” Jesus indicates here that he did not know what to say until he first heard it from the Father… he did not know what to do until he first saw the Father doing it. This description is meant to bring to mind the image of a child learning by watching his father. Paul put it this way: “Be imitators of God as dearly loved children” and “follow after me (my example) as I follow after Christ.” Like Jesus, we must watch the Father and listen to the Father, and only then can we do as he does. (It is because of this that I find it worthwhile to read the book of Proverbs as though it were written by the Father God to Jesus.)
It is also worth noting that Jesus clearly admitted that he did not have all knowledge, and that only the Father does. Matthew 24:36 “But about that day or hour no one knows, not even… the Son, but only the Father.” If Jesus “knew everything from birth” as those who argued you claim, then this verse cannot be true. It would be interesting to see the mental gymnastics required to work around this.
Mental gymnastics is right! I think this way of thinking comes from some sort of dualism where the human side of Jesus gets divorced from His divine side.
It is such a difficult concept to get wrapped around our mind. In Young’s translation Phillipians 2:6-7 says : who, being in the form of God, thought [it] not robbery to be equal to God, but did empty himself, the form of a servant having taken, in the likeness of men having been made- & so there was a voluntary knosis (emptying) of himself. I’ve always used the example of time. God is timeless not bound by it constraints.
But Jesus had to live within the constraints of time. A limiting of his divinity.
yes, part of the mystery of Jesus is how his human and divine natures worked together. Certainly there were constraints, but which ones?
I agree. From the verses you’ve stated here it’s pretty obvious that during the incarnation Jesus had to learn, that he wasn’t omnipresent. This, as you know, is all part of the Kenosis doctrine, that Jesus chose to set aside the independent use of some of his attributes in order to fulfill His mission, to become fully man. He in nor way shape or form ceased to be God, He was and is and always will be God because He is YHWH. That never ceased. There will always be some mystery, as can be expected when trying to comprehend the eternal God of the universe with finite knowledge. Scripture gives us a glimpse.
Great points you have all made. Jesus being fully man, had to also learn how to live his human existence cooperating with His father. He in essence said that I only do what the Father teaches me, tells me and shows me. It is pretty clear this is a parent/son or teacher/student relationship. See John 5:19-20, John 7:17, John 8:28, John 14:26. As Jesus had to learn how to walk in the power of the Spirit so it has become true for us. Jesus is now teaching us to do the same. John 14:26
Yes.
I think some people are afraid that if Jesus had to learn, this means that maybe he made some mistakes… you know, sins. Obviously, that couldn’t have happened, so it must be he didn’t learn. Or some sort of logic along those lines.
Thanks for that comment Jeremy. I think you are right about that.
Some people think that if you learn to be obedient, that you must have been somehow disobedient before. But what if I learn to be a good husband, not being a husband at all prior? Does it mean I was somehow a “bad” husband before? I learn my wife’s needs for protection, shelter, security and gladly accept those responsibilities – even though it might take extra effort, even discomfort – because I love her. I learn to be a good husband through the slight suffering I go through.
I think that Jesus learning must be true. The Bible says that Jesus was acquainted with grief, (Isaiah 53) He was tempted in all ways as we are (Heb 2:18) and therefore he can understand what we are going through (Heb 4:15)
Jesus understands. He can be right there beside us, feeling our anguish at the situation. He experienced life, just like we do, thus he “knows”. What a friend our GOD really is!!!!
Jeremy, tried to post a response to your question. Here goes. Restrained by time (as I alluded to in my original comments), authority (to his parents) and living life in our world (being bruised, hungry, tired etc). All voluntary I believe, a laying aside certain privileges of being God, I guess you could say.
Jesus was a man from Galilee who become a Son of God when the Holy Spirit came upon Him. Remember, it wasn’t until after the Spirit of God rested upon him that God said, “This is My Beloved Son in whom I am well pleased.” Likewise we too become Sons(and Daughters) of God in the same way as Christ did. And part of the path to become filled with God’s Spirit is to learn, and grow. Jesus was the first among ‘many brethren’. But as long as we continue to believe that he was God the Creator in human form, we will subconsciously place his attributes and powers just out of our reach since we are mere mortals and therefore we will become less likely to believe we too can become like Christ.
Jesus learned the path to Sonship through the things he observed, especially religious hypocrisy and oppression.
Along with all the other great comments- This one in particular by Nicholas is profound and insightful! More followers of Christ need to know this! Great topic Jeremy!
Adoptionism is a false doctrine. The WORD was MADE Flesh. There is the Deity of Christ.
Nicholas, you said; “Jesus was a man from Galilee who become a Son of God when the Holy Spirit came upon Him.” Just a man, yes but not just any man, as he was the only begotten of God. He was born with his fathers blood line, his Fathers sinless , perfect, untainted blood. The blood line goes through the father, not the mother, as you can find this out through any medical book. This made him a special “thing”, as the angel called him, as what else could one call something human with holy blood, except a “Holy Thing”. It is all recorded in Luke 1:35. He was born the Son of God, and was to be called such at that time!
Referring to the scripture Matthew 3:17, this in no way tells us chronological order of things, but merely expressing his pleasure of Jesus obedience being “Gods Son”. Thanks
Great post. Discussed here: http://trinities.org/blog/archives/5121 God bless, Dale
Will come check it out. Thanks.
Is Jesus a Muslim Prophet? http://www.scribd.com/doc/193487618/IS-PROPHET-JESUS-AS-A-MUSLIM-PROPHET
I think we can get closer to god if we pray selflessly and with full devotion and we do not go on a wrong path i.e. we have a good behaviour for others and we consider all as equal and we respect all and love all the creations of god and try not to hurt anyone.
I am late to this party. Recently my pastor at Village Church in RSF, CA did a sermon discussing how the human-Jesus had to learn –practically everything — for all the reasons discussed above.
I am not in the Gnostic, Jesus-is-only-divine-not-human camp; He was and is human (yesterday, today and forever, in fact); however, I would argue that as divine, Jesus shares in the divine attributes, of which omniscience is one.
I find that this discussion centers a great deal about our trying to dissect the technology of God, using our human rational processes to do so. In that sphere, we are woefully inadequate to even address the subject; that being the mystery of the divine-human nature of the God-Man Jesus.
Further I would assert that Jesus as the One who created all things also created the biological process of human learning; and since all wisdom comes from God, the assertion in Luke of Jesus’ growth in “wisdom” is not completely ‘learning’ as we humans ascribe but something altogether as divine-human as Jesus was himself.
To me Jesus is the fulfillment of God’s expression of Himself to humanity for humanity’s benefit. We could never know about God without Jesus nor without the Spirit of Christ, which is the Holy Spirit, who Himself is One with Christ and the Father.
So did the child-Jesus learn to walk and talk like other kids? I say yes, and no. When He questioned the teachers in the Temple at age 12 was He asking questions for which He already knew the answers, or was He asking them because he did not know the answers? My position is the former, because in my mind the entire life of Jesus was God’s expression of Himself revealing Himself in every action, every breath, every utterance.
But what of the Hebrews 5:9 quote about “learning”? The next verse gives us more information: “having been perfected” “brought to full development” greek “teleiotheis.”
How can perfection become perfected? It cannot. It either is or is not perfect. However, it can “come into our view,” be revealed at the proper time, — become manifested by the Hand of the One in control of all things.
In my opinion, that is what I think is going on. Summation: I reject both the view that Jesus had to learn ONLY like a human to become God and I also reject the Gnostic view that Jesus was not human at all and was completely divine at all times.
Excellent.
Just came across this, years after you wrote it of course.
Working on a message series on disciplines, and researching the topic of “Did Jesus study?” in preparation. You debate brought a thought to mind that may or may not be worthy of sharing:
If Jesus was born into and raised in and ministered in a culture where the vast majority of knowledge and wisdom is communicated orally via spoken word and oral tradition,
then does it perhaps follow that “to study” was primarily done by listening and speaking?
After all, the literacy rate would have been very, very low.
So, then, would scriptures portraying Jesus as listening, hearing, watching, speaking be implicit examples of him “learning”?
Perhaps even better examples, given the culture at the time?
I’ll take your answers off air. 🙂
You should seriously consider the possibility that Jesus Christ was the Son of God and not actually God Almighty. The bible makes a lot more sense when you believe this truth.
Orthodox Christianity doesn’t accept the overwhelmingly consistent biblical teaching that the prophesied Messiah is fully a human being.
The biblical language provides a crystal clear prophecy of the “coming into existence” of the Son: Lk 1:35; Mat 1:20; Acts 13:33; 1Jn 5:18
According to Heb 1.1-2 there was no Son until he came into existence in Mary (Luke 1:35; Matt. 1:18, 20: “brought into existence in her”)
The Son began to exist in the womb of his mother as Luke 1:35 (gennao) reports along with Mat 1:18, 20 (genesis); 1 John 5:18 (not KJV)
Jesus is ADONI the Messiah, not ADONAI, the One God. God is one person only, the Father. We know this from Ps. 110:1: YHWH speaks to adoni.
The Hebrew language is precise & the rabbis always held the name of the One God in the highest reverence. That’s why ADONAI alone is God.
The man, the historical Messiah Jesus, was indeed in the image of God, & was the visible image of the invisible God: Col. 1:15; 1Tim 2.5.
The Hebrew text tells us that the 2nd Lord of Ps 110.1 is ADONI (my lord). This word appears 195x in the OT & it NEVER means God
The church has for centuries, since post-biblical times, defined God as 3 Persons. Jesus defined God as 1 Person, the Father: John 17.3
Jesus clearly has prior knowledge outside of the womb as HE references things like He saw the devil fall from heaven, and the glory he had with God before the world began. It is very apparent that Jesus did not just pick up the scriptures, realise that everything applied to him, and started to muse over the possibility of himself being the Saviour, ending with an understanding that yes he was.
We know that Jesus does not make mistakes.
If we can’t understand Jesus ‘learning’ doesn’t literally mean, all he ever knew was his personal earthly experiences, then the failure lies with us.
As for the above christadelphian or JW or whomever, there are those who reject Jesus at different levels.
Let us not try to take scripture out of context or distort it to fit our minds, but trust God 100% for discernment on how to interpret.
Yes! He was our example in all things. How could He be our example without facing this life with the same limitations as we do? Another great scripture for this is Hebrews 2:17: “Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.”
it says He was made like us in ALL things. The scripture says it, I believe it 🙂
There were a couple of flaws in your logic. Being human only requires you to have certain physical features. A genius is no less human that someone with severe mental disorders.
Jesus had many “tools” not inherently available to any humans although he abided by certain rules in order to fulfill prophecy. ie) He allowed himself to be crucified and he performed many miracles.
He had profound knowledge that no one else knew in the world. He then passed on this information to his disciples who later went on to perform miracles themselves.
I do agree with you that Jesus probably did learn things while he was human, he also had access to information no one else did due to his close relationship with God.
It would seem that the full experience of human struggle would require an education. Consider how the Proverbs utilizes the acquisition of knowledge and wisdom as the division between the fool and the wise. In fact the temptation of pride is always present in the learning process. The student submits to the teacher and the student must maintain humility. Humility is one of the primary marks of the Word becoming flesh. To know all from the beginning requires no humility at all. The education of Christ in suffering often reffered to in this thread seems to me to extend beyond the physical pain of the passion. It began with the pain of existing in human form with all it’s limitations, temptations and developmental processes. Jesus was not omniscient in His earthly state but relied on what was revealed by the Holy Spirit. He admitted that He did not know the time of His return at the time He was teaching but that was held in confidence by the Father. At some point surely it was disclosed after His ascension, and thus He learned one more thing.
I find it odd that the Bible gives very little account of Jesus growing up. If his parents were worried about his absence at age 12 and already been told by an angel and a dream before his birth, that he was the divine son of God, it sounds like they reverting to thinking he was a normal human child where harm could befall him. Does not make sense to me.
There are very few people who could have been the source on that account. His mother or maybe a brother. I think you have to really consider thier human anxieties. Anyone who ever lost a child at the mall can relate. But the story represents a rite of passage in Jesus life more than a statement of his parents veiw of him.
Jesus did learn as you say, and the verses you bring up are good for pointing to that.
However, Jesus was the son of God, not God himself. Jesus never claimed to be God. There is only one God, the Father (John 17:3). But God has more than one definition as Jesus brings up in John 10 when referring to Psalm 82:6.
“God” is a word that can also mean magistrate/judge. In this way, Jesus is a god, as God has made him judge and given him authority and life to give.
Jesus would never claim to be God; he loved his Father God and believed in the one God of the Jews (Mark 12:29-30; Deut. 6:4-5). It is Christianity and its misguided dogmas that claim otherwise.
Jesus was a man before and after his resurrection. He is now an exalted man at the right hand of God the Father. Antichrist phrases like “100% God, 100% man” and “god the son” aren’t scriptural. They are made up and promulgated by false teachers that teach as doctrine the traditions of men. The people in your class that think “Jesus didn’t have to learn” are a product of the “Jesus is God” false teaching. It’s sad that Christians would rather fit in with popular dogma than tell the truth and suffer with Christ. Many people in these comments are speaking of all kinds of “doctrines” that, at best, aren’t doctrines at all or, at worst, are doctrines of demons.
1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
It sounds like you might be coming at this from another religion, Islam perhaps? Just guessing. Apologies if I am wrong.
I think one of the factors you might find interesting are the places where Jesus accepted worship. To do this without redirecting the worshippers adoration to the Father instead of Himself was an inference to His divinity. Another case is where the Pharisees accused Jesus of blasphemy for assuming to have the power to forgive the sins of the paralytic man. They declared that no one can forgive sins but God alone. Jesus did not dispute the claim of divine exclusivity in that regard, yet he went on to assert that He had power on earth to forgive sins. Either someone besides God can absolve sinners or Jesus was in fact God in the flesh as John stated. “In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God…the Word became flesh and dwelt among us.” One can adopt JW arguments on the aorist participle but that doesn’t even dispose of the clear assertion that Jesus was preexistent with God before He was born. If Jesus is the Word who became flesh, then who is the Word in heaven?
Further we have another attestation to Jesus divinity from the mouth of Thomas. He bowed to Jesus upon seeing him resurrected and said, “My Lord and my God.”
Granted Jesus always was deferential to the Father and spoke as one subservient to Him. This was not a denial of His own deity but instead a fulfillment of his self imposed role as the last Adam. Jesus completely fulfilled the role of human progenitor of a new creation. In order to fulfill that role He spoke and acted as a man fully under Gods authority.
That is a great follow up question. Really fascinating to even think it through. I feel the answer is in the very same scriptures that sparked this discussion.
When asked by His mother to explain Himself as to why He left them and was in the temple, He responded with:
Luke 2:49 NKJV
[49] And He said to them, “Why did you seek Me? Did you not know that I must be about My Father’s business?”
So it seems that He was aware that He was the Son of God. It would even seem probable that Marry and/or Joseph might have told Jesus of His miraculous birth and who He was meant to be. I still believe He learned all of what this meant, from scripture and directly from His Father.
Gabrielle said this to Marry:
Luke 1:32-33 NKJV
[32] He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. [33] And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.”
So I believe scripture demonstrates that He was aware of who He was from a very young age. Mary clearly was told that Jesus was to be the Messiah, the anointed King.
It’s funny thinking about Jesus as a child, I still would fall at His feet. Those shepherds and magi that came to see Him as an infant… what an honor to witness such a thing.
Thanks for stimulating thoughts of admiration of Jesus in me. I’m blessed by it.
If Jesus truly grew in wisdom, it has to have been from perfect wisdom to greater, but still perfect wisdom. Otherwise, he would have been, at some point, Unwise. Foolish.
If Jesus’s increase in knowledge included moral knowledge, then at some point, he would have had to have been morally ignorant at some level.
If Jesus’ learning of obedience was anything ither then from infinite knowledge to infinite knowledge, then it would mean that at some point, he was disobedient.
If Jesus was not morally perfect from the beginning, then he would have been a sinner, as Torah clearly teaches that we are able to sin through ignorance (Lev. 4).
God’s law takes advantage of our weaknesses to make us sin (Galatians 3, Romans 7). If Jesus increased in any moral capacity, it can only have been like the expansion of the universe. Otherwise, God’s law would have caught him and made him sin at some point.
Therefore, the idea of Jesus truly “learning” as we know it would have made him a sinner. We learn by making mistakes. Making a moral mistake is a sin, therefore Jesus learned nothing morally. He only learned how to express morality by learning how to pilot a human body.
The leap from learning to sinning seems rather drastic. Adam and Eve would have learned many things befor the fall and had they not fallen they would have continued that learning process. To be a learner is not the same as being a sinner. Jesus learned obedience in a new and wholly different capacity. He had to go through the human experience as a human. He already knew the human experience as God, the omniscient observer, but can that ever be the same as being the limited human sufferer? That is what God in the flesh learned. What it means to be in the flesh like us. As such he is a perfect high priest who is able to make intercession for us before the Father. The scripture seems to preclude his qualification to fulfill that role without learning the human struggle.
However what he did not learn is what it is to be a sinner. He was tempted in a]every way just as we are yet remained sinless. He was the first and only infallible human. The day will come when we are resurrected that we will be completed as a new creation and become infallible beings made in his likeness.
If God even remotely desired to make us infallible beings, he would have created us infallible beings, not fallible beings with such a propensity to sin that it is literally impossible to be sinless without being God in the flesh.
Worse still, the omniscient observer has more knowledge of being human than the human does by experiencing humanity. That’s how omniscience works. If experience were the goal, then Jesus didn’t even come close to learning how to be a human. He could relate to us by experience the way a dolphin can relate to a bacterium.
He CAN’T have been tempted in everyway as we are BECAUSE he was without sin. He had no internal drives to sin except in basic exercise of self-preservation in gethsemene and in the desert. He didn’t have to even think when the devil “tempted” him, any more than we have to think when “tempted” by an intrusive thought about jumping into a volcano. Real temptation itself is a sin because we are defiled from within. What comes out of a man makes him unclean. Jesus had no internal struggle because there was nothing unclean within him to struggle against. Even observing your own innate sex drive that God cursed you to always have upon seeing an attractive woman is a sin as great as adultery, according to Jesus’ teaching, if you don’t first have your wedding certificate with both your names on it. How can a man without a sex drive relate to temptation of lust? You might as well ask an abyssal oceanic vent worm about the atmospheric conditions on Mars.
Yes I very much think Jesus HAD to learn, and even in heaven before coming down and being born or Mary. There is a reason He is the ‘Son’ of God, there is a Parent/Child relationship that Jesus (and us) needs.
I would like to add the verses from Is 7 15 He will be eating curds and honey when he knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, 16 for before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, the land of the two kings you dread will be laid waste.
And also I do tend take the days of creation as a Father/Son project. Jesus asks and the Father creates what He asks. Note that the second day of creation was not said to be ‘good’ like the others, but in the end it was complete to the point that the Father knew it was done and was said to be very good, and to take a sabbath rest. What was this project? To us the world/universe and life, to Jesus at the time some fun project, to the Father perhaps the greatest gift a Father could give His only child, the greatest family possible full of brothers and sisters – family – as his inheritance. But Jesus had to become part of His creation to gain His inheritance.
Just to add, God said about Adam, it was not good for the man to be alone. Note that God the Father, and animals were not enough, Adam needed His own kind, would that also not apply to Jesus, who at the end marries His bride? What is bound in heaven is bound on earth
great article, I believe in logic too when studying the Scriptures 🤭 👍
you bring up a good point about Jesus being human and learning
I guess I would have fallen in the camp of people that was arguing with you. “the Bible say”
however, it appears there would be a time of learning the human body that every soul experiences.
however in the Hebrews passage that you quote could “learn” actually mean “experience “. like doctors learn in school. but experience in their work. and getting the flesh to obey would be a new experience. so if he learned he did it without failure because he showed us all how to deal with anxiety in the garden “not my will but thine”