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Because the Bible Tells Me So… or does it?

By Jeremy Myers
28 Comments

Because the Bible Tells Me So… or does it?

Do you struggle with the Bible? Do you wrestle with what it says, what it means, and how to apply it to your life?

Confession time…

I do.

Here’s another confession….

When it comes to helping me understand what to do with Scripture,ย Bible college and seminary didn’t help me much. In fact, some days, I wonder if Bible College and Seminary hindered more than they helped.

We have probably all had run-ins with Christians who like to condemn others (or condemn you) by saying, “The Bible says it; I believe it; that settles it.”

Okay, here’s another confession…

god said it I believe it that settles itI used to be one of those Christians. I used to preach that very thing.

Anyway, the only thing that Bible College and Seminary really did for me was giving a more “scholarly” way of saying, “The Bible says it; I believe it; that settles it.”

We were trained to talk about the Greek and Hebrew, and to reference the cultural, historical, and grammatical contexts of whatever passage were were studying, thereby giving us more and better ammunition against those with whom we disagreed.

In the end though, it all boiled down to the same thing…

Though the uneducated masses say, “The Bible says it; I believe it; that settles it!” I could now say, “The Hebrew says this, the cultural background study backs it up, therefore, I believe it, and you better not disagree with me, you ignorant and uneducated worm!”

Anyway, I have begun to try to back away from that sort of approach to Scripture, mostlyย because it looks nothing like Jesus, and have begun to try to figure out what the Bible is, how it should be used, and how it should be read, taught, and applied to our lives.

The Bible Tells Me So

So it was with great interest that I recently picked up The Bible Tells Me So, by Peter Enns. I had previously read his book, Inspiration and Incarnation, and found it extremely helpful, and so decided to read this newest book of his as well.

The Bible Tells me So

As with everything Dr. Enns writes, this book was full of deep insights and helpful ideas about the nature and authority of Scripture. What surprised me most about this most recent book, however, was the keen sense of humor that was displayed on every page. There were numerous places where I laughed out loud at what I was reading. Dr. Enns has a very good sense of humor!

Humor is important for a book like this, where so much of what is foundational to many forms of modern Christianity is being challenged.

Inย The Bible Tells Me So, Peter Enns attempts to present an approach to Scripture which allows for us to accept that it has historical and scientific errors and that it contradicts itself at various places, and yet still retain the Bible as an important witness to the theological and spiritual struggles which were faced by our forefathers in the faith, and more importantly, as a historical document about the life of Jesus and how the death and resurrection of Jesus resulted in the transformation of the first century mediterranean world.

Reading over that paragraph again, I am pretty sure that Peter Enns would not agree with how I phrased everything in there…

…Maybe it is best to say this: Peter Enns wants us to stop agreeing with the Bible in everything it says, and instead, begin arguing with God about what is in the Bible. That, he says, is the purpose of Scripture. He says that if the Bible teaches us anything about God, it is that we learn about God and develop a relationship with Him, not by simply accepting everything the Bible says, but by actually engaging with God in a spirited (both senses of the word are intended there) discussion about the Bible.

In other words … don’t be this guy…

wrong approach to Scripture

Frankly, I really, really like this approach, because (as you may know if you have been reading my blog for the past six years or so), this is all I have been able to do with Scripture for the past decade or so. Despite all my training and education, I still cannot make heads or tails of the Bible. If Peter Enns is right, this is exactly how God wants it!

Though not directly stated anywhere, Peter Enns appears to be a proponent of the idea that the Bible is a library of books written by various authors from various theological perspectives, who are in dialogue with each other over the nature of God and what the human response to Him should be. Others who hold this view say that rather than the Bible being “uni-vocal,” it is “multi-vocal.” That is, rather than speaking with one voice on various topics and subjects, there are numerous voices, and sometimes they disagree with and even contradict one another.

In The Bible Tells Me So, Peter Enns begins by showing that mostย of the traditional approaches to the Bible don’t match up with what the Bible actually appears to be. Following this, he goes through several sections of the Bible, forcing us to read it and see it in a way that you probably won’t hear in most seminaries, churches, or home Bible studies. Then, the book concludes with some explanation of how Jesus, Paul, and the apostles used Scripture, and what we should do with the Bible as it is.ย 

Frankly, this book is going to require a second read for me, and I plan on reading it out loud to my wife. She is a better theologian than I am, and I trust that she will have discernment to see the right (and wrong) with what Peter Enns has written. I figure that if he invites us to argue with God about the Bible, he will not mind too much if my wife and I argue with him…

For now, though, here is my one main reservation about what Peter Enns has written (I have many reservations about the book …. please don’t read my review as a glowing endorsement)…

The problem with the approach of Peter Enns in The Bible Tells Me So is not so much in what he says, but in the logicalย ramifications of what he says.

For example, he says that the Bible teaches us about Jesus (p. 237). But does it? If large chunks of Scripture are stories that have been fabricated to answer the pressing social and theological questions of the author’s day (pp. 75, 94, 105, 107-130, etc.), why could this not also have been true about the stories of Jesus? This is especially true if the Gospel authors were not actually eyewitnesses to Jesus (as Enns believes – p. 78).

Ultimately, if Enns is right, the Bible is little more than the best-selling piece of historical literature of all time. Is it inspiring? Yes! Interesting? Sure! Can it guide us in our own life and with our own questions? You bet! Is it life changing? It can be. But is it really from God? Not so much.

the bible tells me soLook, this approach to Scripture is way better than the fundamentalist approach where we carry out all manner of atrocities inย Jesus’ name. But I just struggle with having a Bible like this. If Enns is right, what sets the Bible apart from other religious books? How can it be authoritative at all? How can it be reliable or trustworthy in what it says about anything?

In the end, I highly recommend you buy and read The Bible Tells Me So. I recommend it, not because I agree with everything that is written (though in time, maybe I will!), but because the book made me think. This is the best kind of book! I like books that make me think, even when I disagree.

Hmmm…. maybe that is what the Bible is after all….

Until then, ย what sort of issues do you have with Scripture? Do youย think that theย approach of Peter Enns (according to my woefully inadequate summary above) could provide a way of escape from your problems with the Bible? Or do you think his approach simply creates more (and greater) difficulties? Let me know in the comment section!

God is z Bible & Theology Topics: bible, bible reading, Bible Study, books, Books I'm Reading, Theology of the Bible

You can help others with their Bible Questions in the Forum!

By Jeremy Myers
7 Comments

You can help others with their Bible Questions in the Forum!

bible and theology forum

Help others with their Bible and Theology questions!

Over the past several months, I have received dozens of Bible and theology questions using the contact form on the right sidebar, and due to time constraints, I have not been able to answer most of them.

So I am going to post them in the forum and let you provide answers to these Bible and theology questionsย if you want….ย go check them out!

Here are a few examples:

Why is God so violent in Numbers 15:32-36? (Go suggest an answer)

Why did Paul re-baptize twelve men in Acts 19? (Go suggest an answer)

Do all Christians speak in tongues? (Go suggest an answer)

Why are there so many different beliefs among churches? (Go suggest an answer)

Is masturbation a sin? (Go suggest an answer … if you dare!)

Notes from Others

There have also been a couple interesting posts from others. Here is something Justin Wiles wrote:

Ever since I have … been able to share my story and struggles with the community the Holy Spiritโ€™s power to fight sin in my life has abounded. Itโ€™s still a rough battle but I hold faith that Iโ€™m growing more and more.

So feel free to share a daily victory or a struggle so that we can come together in the spirit of truth and love and encourage everyone to keep fighting the good fight!

Have you found this to be true in your own life? Has community (online and in person) been helpful as you learn to follow Jesus and defeat temptation? I have! If you want to weigh in on Justin’s thread, you can do so here.

There have also been several new introductions from new members on the forum. Go and read them here, and introduce yourself as well!

James Johnson III wrote this:

I have no Seminary experience, but I consider myself autodidactic and my thirst for knowledge has lead me all over the gamut of belief systems in Christianity (I ended up a staunch Calvinist until recently). I consider myself in a state of cognitive dissonance, so Iโ€™m hoping to learn a lot and I have a plethora of questions.

Frank wrote this:

My profession is evaluating community development programs facilitated by Christian agencies. In more than 25 years of doing evaluations in Africa and Asia I have discovered that strong Christians often do not see the conflicts that there are between science worldview and Christian worldview.

I always find it fascinating to learn more about the people who read this blog, and I love it when you interact with each other as you so often do in the comment sections on the forums. Thank you for making this blog a place where people can gather online and discuss life, Scripture, and theology.

Join the Forum!

If you want to introduce yourself, or ask a Bible or theology question for others to answer, head on over to the forum and get started! See you there!

God is Redeeming Life, Redeeming Scripture, Redeeming Theology Bible & Theology Topics: Bible and Theology Questions, Bible questions, Blogging, forum, Theology - General, worldview

It’s the White Man’s Fault! It’s the Black Man’s Fault!

By Jeremy Myers
14 Comments

It’s the White Man’s Fault! It’s the Black Man’s Fault!

People love to point fingers.

It’s been happening since the Garden of Eden when, after he ate from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, Adam said to God, “The woman, whom you gave to me, gave me the fruit and I ate.” Adam not only blames Eve, but blames God as well.

When God turns to Eve, she said, “Don’t look at me! It was the serpent!” She also was implying that it was God’s fault. After all, didn’t God create the serpent and put it in the Garden?

Down through the eons of history, this approach has been our standard operating procedure. Every time something goes bad in our life, our family, our town, our country, or our world, everybody starts pointing the finger at everybody else.

pointing the finger

Take the events in the Middle East for the past 20 years:

It’s the West’s fault for what is happening in the Middle East! Death to the great satan!

No, it’s the Muslims fault! Let’s blow them off the face of the earth!

No, it’s not Muslims; it’s onlyย extremistย Muslims.

Yeah, but Muslims only become extreme in reaction to Western abuse of power.

Who cares? Let’s kill ’em all and let God sort it out! (Have you ever seen this bumper sticker?)

The same sort of conversation happened during the “Occupy Wall Street” protests:

All those rich people are to blame for our county’s problems. They are stealing our money!

No we’re not! You are poor because you just want to sit out here, hold signs, and commit crimes!

But that’s only because we can’t get jobs because you are so greedy!

We can’t hire anybody because Obamaย — whom you voted into office —ย ruined our economy. ย It’s your own damn fault!

Then there are the recent events in Ferguson, MO:

You white people are always killing black people for no reason!

What? It was self-defense! And he was a criminal!

Self-defense?! You shot him six times! ย You’re all racist!

No, we’re trying to uphold the law. Look at you! You’re rioting and looting stores. You’re all criminals!

ferguson racial tension

We could go on and on and on. This sort of exchange takes place every day in our lives, communities, job sites, and even families.

And you want to know what the solution is? Jesus showed it to us, if we have courage to look.

The solution is crucifixion … not of our enemies, but of ourselves.

Death truly is the answer … but not the death of our foes, but of me. I. Myself.

The church claims it follows Jesus, but we only want to follow Him if it leads to personal glory, pay raises, a higher standard of living, and the death and destruction of our enemies.

Nobody wants to follow Jesus into death; especially into death for our enemies …ย and maybe even at the hands of our enemies.

This is hard teaching, and frankly, I am not fully sure about how to live it out.

As I write this, my inner self is screaming, “But what does that mean, Jeremy?!” And frankly, I don’t know. Actually, I don’t think I want to know.

I am not ready to follow Jesus into death.

The idea terrifies me.

But I believe that following Jesus into death is the only way that violence and finger-pointing will ever end. As long as I refuse to own up to the violence and hatred in my own heart, I will forever be pointing the finger at someone else, saying, “They made me do it!”

dying for our enemies

It’s not the white man’s fault or the black man’s fault. It’s me.

It’s not the rich people or the poor people. It’s me.

It’s not the Muslims or the Christians. It’s me.

It’s not the Democrats or the Republicans. It’s me.

Thisย is the first step in dying to ourselves. Recognizing that I am the one at fault, I am the one to blame, is the first step toward laying down our lives for others.

Racial tensions are at an all-time high. White people blame the black man, and black people blame the white man. But neither is at fault. I am the one at fault.

It is not “they” who must die, but me. If Jesus is our guide, we bring peace, not by killing others, but by laying down our lives for others, and especially for our enemies.ย 

This post is part of the September 2014 Synchroblog. Below is a list of other bloggers who contributed to the Synchroblog this month. Go read them all and see what others have to say about race and violence.

  • Wendy McCaig โ€“ Race, Violence, and a Silent White Americaย 
  • Glenn Hager โ€“ Can We Even Talk About Racial Issues?
  • Carol Kuniholm โ€“ Who is Allowed to Vote?ย 
  • Sarah Quezada โ€“ Race, Violence, and the Airport Immigration Agent
  • Wesley Rotoll โ€“ Race, Violence, and Why We Need to Talk About Itย 
  • Kathy Escobar โ€“ We Have a Dream

God is z Bible & Theology Topics: blame, crucifixion, cruciform, Discipleship, enemies, love, racist, scapegoat, synchroblog

The Woman with Issues (of blood)

By Jeremy Myers
6 Comments

The Woman with Issues (of blood)

LT LewisThis is a guest post by L. T. Lewis. L. T. is a spiritual mentor, and the founder of Kick Boxing Believers. Well-adjusted P.K. (preacherโ€™s kid) and grateful mother of two young adults. She teaches and guides individuals/groups towards a more joyful, healthy, abundant and faith-filled out-of-the-box life!

Connect with L. T. through Twitter and LinkedIn.

If you would like to write a Guest Post for the Till He Comes Blog, begin by reading the Guest Blogger Guidelines.

In Mark 5:25-34, there was a woman with some issues that she needed fixed.

I hear the men thinking, โ€œWhat woman doesnโ€™t have issues?โ€

For the record she fully acknowledged her shortcomings and was working on a solution. She spent all that she had over twelve years working on her issues. I know the scripture says the woman had a singular issue but that one issue had many companions.

Heard1_lightstock_149830_small_lisa_

For example, the Law of Moses required that a woman during her menstruation was to live in exile from the first sight of blood until days after her the last sighting of blood. She wasnโ€™t supposed to leave the house and if she did she had to let everyone know that she was unclean.

Now those are some issues!

Jesus Healed the Woman with the Issue of Blood

The stories of Jesus performing miracles; healing the sick, raising the dead and forgiving men their sins had traveled far and wide by word of mouth. She heard that Jesus was nearby and she made her way to Him.

As a result of all she had heard about Him, she had faith enough to know that all she had to do was touch Him and she would be healed. She didnโ€™t let her issue keep her in exile. She didnโ€™t lead the crowd deter her. She pressed her way through the crowd.

it does not appear from the text that the woman with the issue of blood wasย crying out โ€œUnclean! Unclean!โ€ If someone is shouting, โ€œUnclean! Unclean!โ€ย in a crowd, people would have taken note of where she was and what she was doing. But according to the scripture when she finally made her way to Jesus and touched Him, no one knew it was her until she identified herself.

issue of bloodSo she worked her way through the crowd, drew near to Jesus, and touched him. According to Jewish law, she should not have done this. She had to have known that since she was unclean, touching others would make them unclean as well. According to some interpretations of Jewish law, her behavior at this point would be sinful.

Yet when she touched Jesus, she was healed immediately!

Jesus knew that someone had touched Him and began to look around the crowd to determine who it was. He asked, “Who touched me?”

His trusty disciples, always at the ready, basically asked Him, โ€œWho hasnโ€™t touched you Jesus?โ€ It sounds as if they were totally surround basically moving elbow to elbow so literally everybody is touching everybody. But the disciples didnโ€™t understand.

The womanโ€™s faith in action moved Jesus to look for and see her. Even when this woman with the issue of blood behaved in ways that others might have interpreted as sinful, Jesus saw the faith that was behind her actions, and she was healed.

Do You have Issues?

Are you a believer with issues? Answer honestly!

Maybe we don’t have “issues” like hers,ย but we certainly have issues that need healing.

So step out, look to Jesus, and move toward him in faith, trusting that He is able to heal and restore you. Whatever your issue is — even if some people think it is sinful and it makes you “unclean” — Jesus isn’t scared off or offended. He loves you and wants to restore you. So reach out to Jesus, touch Him, and be healed!

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: faith, guest post, Mark 5:25-34, works

Amazed at Human Creativity in the Midst of the Fall

By Jeremy Myers
4 Comments

Amazed at Human Creativity in the Midst of the Fall

I am constantly amazed at how the creativity which God has placed into the hearts of men shines through, even in places where the fall has brought devastating and paralyzing consequences.

typewriter art

Cerebral Palsy, while not a sin, is still a consequence of living in a fallen world, but watch the following video and see the sort of beauty that comes off the fingertips of a man who suffers from this disease.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: creation, death, Discipleship, life, sin

3 Tactics Calvinists Use Against Non-Calvinists

By Jeremy Myers
226 Comments

3 Tactics Calvinists Use Against Non-Calvinists

In my current series on Calvinism, I have had several Calvinists leave comments about their areas of disagreement with what I have written.

I fully expect and invite disagreement. Please … if you are a Calvinist and disagree with what I am writing, let me know, and present your views!

However, I have noticed a trend in the comments that have been left by Calvinists thus far. There seems to be three main tactics or approaches that Calvinists have used in their attempts to defend their ideas and disprove mine.

1. Name Calling

Calvinist name callingIt always surprises me how quickly some Calvinists turn to name calling as a way to defend their ideas. If you are not a Calvinist and seek to teach your views, be prepared to be called a heretic, a reprobate, a mouthpiece of Satan, and a fool. Some Calvinists may simply say that you are stupid, ignorant, orย spiritually blind.

When I was in grade-school, I never understood why some kids thought they could win arguments by calling other people names, and I still don’t understand it today.

Very rarely ย is there anyย proper place in serious theological discussion for cajoling, slander, vilification, and the mocking of others.

If you are a Calvinist and you believe that I am stupid, ignorant, and the mouthpiece of Satan because I am not a Calvinist, show it by the weight of your exegetical arguments; not by calling me silly names.

2. Scripture Quotations

Along with name calling, Calvinists seem to think that everybody would become a Calvinist if they would just “read their Bible.” I often find that when Calvinists disagree, they think they can settle the argument by telling the person to go “read their Bible.”

Of course, I find this tactic used by many various groups within Christianity. Most people seem to think that what they believe is exactly what the Bible teaches, and if people would read the Bible, they would come to the same beliefs.

bible quotes Calvinist

What many Calvinists do not seem to graspย is that reading the Bible is one thing; understanding it is another.ย Even highly educated and well-respected scholars and Bible teachers disagree with each other about the meaning of the text.

Do I read and study the Bible? Of course! I have been reading and studying it for decades. In fact, it is exactly because of my reading and studying that I eventually abandoned Calvinism.

Often, along with inviting non-Calvinists to just “read the Bible,” Calvinists like to type out longs lists of Bibleย quotes which the Calvinists thinks proves and defends the Calvinistic system of theology.

Their approach goes like this:

You heretic! If you had simply read the Bible, you would know that you are filled with the lies of the devil! Here’s proof:

Bible Quotation 1

Bible Quotation 2

Bible Quotation 3

etc …

In fact, one classic book on Calvinism (The Five Points of Calvinism) contains little else but pages upon pages of Bible quotations.

In a post from several years ago, I referred to this tactic as Shotgun Hermeneutics. Some people seem to think they can win theology debates by simply quoting a lot of Bible verses, as if the other person was not aware of those verses and had never read them in the Bible.

Usually, when Calvinists do this to me, I simply reply with a comment like this:

I am fully aware of all of these verses. I have read them many, many times, and I have deeply studied most of them in the Greek or Hebrew, as well as in their historical, cultural, and grammatical contexts. I simply have a different understanding of these verses than you do, and if you read some of the others posts on this blog, you will learn how I understand those texts you quoted.

Of course, Calvinists think their understandingย of Scripture is the only valid one, and part of this is because of their appeals to tradition and authority.

3. Appeals to Tradition and Authority

The final tactic that Calvinists often use to defend Calvinism is with appeals to tradition and authority. Usually, if you disagree with a Calvinist on the meaning of a particular Bible verse, rather than deal with the exegetical evidence that was prevented about the verse, they will say that your understanding is wrong, because it disagrees with what John Calvin, John Piper, or John MacArthur teaches (or some other Calvinist).

calvinistic authority and traditionI have a book in my library where an extremely popular Calvinist in which he lays and defends the Calvinistic doctrines. When I first read it, I was a Calvinist, but I remember being extremely uncomfortable with how he defended his views. Rather than base his arguments on a detailed analysis of pertinent Scripture texts, he tended to quote St. Augustine (who predated Calvinism), John Calvin, and other prominent Calvinistic theologians.

There is nothing inherently wrong with pointing out that other Bible teachers and scholars agree with your views, but the trouble comes in when some peopleย seem ignorant of the fact that there are many good and respectable Bible teachers and scholars who disagree.

Furthermore, I always find it interesting that Calvinists praise men like Martin Luther and John Calvin for seeking to reform theย traditional teachings of the Roman Catholic Church, but then condemn those who want to reformย the traditional teachings of the Calvinistic system of theology.

Anyway, even thoughย you can quote a bunch of scholars, authors, and Bible teachers who agree with your perspective, this does not prove that your view is correct.

Main Problem: A Lack of Grace

The main irony or problem with lots of the disagreement that comes from Calvinists is that it lacks grace.

Usually, when a Calvinist engages in the 3 tactics listed above, it is done with a complete lack of grace. I find this most troubling. Why is it that Calvinists, who claim to teach ‘The Doctrines of Grace” are so ungracious when dealing with those who disagree?

If we truly hold to grace, does it not seem that our dealings with others should also be full of grace? I think so.

I know that many non-Calvinists are guilty of the three things above (I fall into them myself sometimes), but what have been your experiences with debating Calvinists? Share in the comments below!

God is z Bible & Theology Topics: Books by Jeremy Myers, Calvinism, grace, Reformed Theology, Theology of Salvation, TULIP

The NEW Finding Church

By Jeremy Myers
20 Comments

The NEW Finding Church

One of the first books I published was a book called Finding Church.

Can I be honest? I wasn’t very fond of that book…

Finding ChurchSo I was thrilled to learn that Wayne Jacobsen, one of my favorite authors (you must read his book So You Don’t Want to Go to Church Anymore)ย and podcasters (check out his podcast, “The God Journey“), was putting out a book by the very same title.

Finding Church, by Wayne Jacobsen

His book, due out in October, is also called Finding Church, but his book will be MUCH better than mine.

In fact, Wayne Jacobsen was kind enough to send me an advance copy of Finding Church,ย and let me tell you, it is as good as I expected.

The last lineย alone is worth the price of the book.

I’m not going to tell you what that last sentence of Finding Churchย is, but it has taken me more than 10 years to discover this truthย (and I’m still learning it). Wayne’s writings and podcast we influential in helping me learn that truth.

One of the things I appreciate most about Finding Church is that Wayne writes in a gracious way what I have been trying to explain for years to various Christians who think I have abandoned God because I no longer “attend church.”

Wayne JacobsenSome people seem to equate Christianity with attending “church.” They seem to believe if you are truly a Christian, or at least, if you are an obedient Christian, you will attend a “church” on Sunday morning. They seem to think that people like me, who no longer make “church” attendance as part of their weekly routine, have fallen away from God, abandoned the faith, or have given up on following Jesus.

Nothing could be further from the truth.

In fact, for people like me, no longer attending “church” has allowed me to follow Jesus in ways I had only dreamed of when I did attend “church” and experience the love of Jesus in ways I never thought possible.

For me, and millions more like me, the decision to no longer attend “church” was not the result of a failure to followย Jesus, but precisely because I was. It is my belief that Jesus led me away from attending “church” so that I could actually see the Church for the first time, and learn toย be the Church in my neighborhood and community.

Obviously, these sorts of statements raise a lot of questions. Wayne’s bookย Finding Church is one of the best books I know of which answers some of these questions, and, more importantly, provides direction, encouragement, and guidance for those who think that Jesus may be inviting them to leave the four walls of institutional Christianity and follow Jesus into a deeper, more adventuresome, intimate, andย real way of living.

In a gracious and loving style, Wayne Jacobsen provides encouragement, hope, and direction to all who have known that there must be something more to this thing we call Church, but have almost despaired of ever finding it.

Are you searching for Church?

If you have been looking for a new church, have been thinking of trying to start a new church, or have been have been wondering about how to be the church, make sure you read Finding Church first.

But be warned! This book doesn’t contain “the answer” you are looking for. There are no “how to” lists or “10 steps” to finding church. The book will, however, open your eyes to see that the Church has been sitting in front of you all along.

Finding Churchย is currently available for preorder from Amazon, or from Wayne’s own website, Lifestream.org. Go order a copy today!

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: be the church, Books I'm Reading, church, finding church, Finding Church, Wayne Jacobsen

John 15:4-5 Does Not Teach Total Inability

By Jeremy Myers
6 Comments

John 15:4-5 Does Not Teach Total Inability

The teaching of Jesus in John 15 about the vine and the branches is sometimes used by Calvinists to support the idea of total inability, especially when Jesus talks about how without Him, people can do nothing.

Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing (John 15:4-5).

John 15 4-5 vine and branches

Calvinists focus on the statements in these verses that a โ€œbranch cannot bear fruit of itselfโ€ and that without Jesus โ€œyou can do nothingโ€ and claim that these statement prove that people cannot do anything on their own, including believe in Jesus for eternal life.

[Jesus] used the illustration of a grapevine and its branches. In speaking of the inability to do good works, He said: โ€œJust as the branch is not able by itself to bear fruitโ€”unless it abides in the vineโ€”so neither can you unless you abide in me. โ€ฆ Apart from me you can do nothingโ€ (John 15:4-5). Thatโ€™s total inability (Palmer, Five Points, 14-15).

So how can we understand John 15:4-5?

First of all, it is important to note that this chapter is part of the โ€œUpper Room Discourseโ€ of John 13โ€“15. It takes place in the upper room of a house in Jerusalem where Jesus and His disciples shared their last supper together, which was a Passover meal. After the meal, Jesus washed the feet of His disciples (John 13:1-17) and then proceeded to give them some final words of instruction and encouragement.

So when Jesus spoke the words which are recorded in John 15:4-5, Jesus was not speaking to people who did not have eternal life, but to those who did. That is, He was speaking to His disciples, to those who were already regenerate.

Among many other things He told His disciples during the Upper Room Discourse, John 15:1-8 is about how the disciples can be productive and fruitful as followers of Jesus.

He basically tells His disciples that they must not try to engage in ministry on their own strength, but must abide and remain in Him. They must stay attached to Jesus. They must look to Him for guidance, wisdom, and strength.

If they try to work in the world under their own power, they will not get very far. They will accomplish nothing.

The Illustration of the Vine and the Branches

The illustration Jesus uses for this lesson is the vine and the branches.

John 15:4-5 vine and branchesJust as a branch cannot bear any fruit unless it remains attached to the vine, so also, the disciples of Jesus will not be able to accomplish anything for the kingdom of God unless they remain connected to Jesus by looking to Him for guidance and direction.

So when John 14:4-5 is studied in context, it quickly becomes obvious that these verses have absolutely nothing to do with the inability of unbelievers to do anything.

Jesus isnโ€™t talking about unbelievers at all!

Instead, Jesus is talking to believers, and specifically to His disciples, telling them (and all future disciples as well) that if we want to minister faithfully within the kingdom of God as followers of Jesus, they must abide in Jesus.

That is, they must look to Him for guidance, seek to follow His example, learn to listen to His voice for wisdom, and depend upon Him for strength.

John 15:4-5 is talking about total inability, but not the total inability of unbelievers.ย  Instead, Jesus is teaching about the total inability of disciples to do anything in the Kingdom of God by their own strength and resources.

If you want to read more about Calvinism, check out other posts in this blog series: Words of Calvinism and the Word of God.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Books by Jeremy Myers, Calvinism, John 15:4-5, sin, Theology of Salvation, Theology of Sin, Total Depravity, total inability, TULIP

John 8:43 does not teach total inability

By Jeremy Myers
3 Comments

John 8:43 does not teach total inability

Calvinists often refer to John 8:43 as evidence that the mind of the unbeliever is so enslaved to sin and bound to darkness that far from being able to do anything to please God, they cannot even hear or understand the truth of Scripture. Here is what Jesus says:

Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word (John 8:43).

The Context of John 8:43

In the context of this passage, Jesus is chastising some of His Jewish audience for not comprehending His message. He then asks the question about why they do not understand, and His answer is that they do not understand because they are not able to listen to what He is saying.

John 8:43 unable to listen or hear

Since Jesus talks about their inability, this text is a favorite text for the Calvinistic idea of total inability (cf. John 8:47).

However, is this really what Jesus is saying?

Inability to Hear is not Inability to Believe

First of all, it should be pointed out that an inability to hear and understand the message of Jesus is not necessarily the same thing as an inability to believe in Jesus for eternal life.

Nowhere in this chapter does Jesus say that the people to whom He speaks cannot believe. He says they cannot hear, which means they do not grasp, comprehend, or understand the truth of what He is saying.

Inability to Hear was Not Permanent

But even this inability to understand Jesus was not a permanent condition.

The Jewish people to whom Jesus spoke had developed this condition, and in John 8, Jesus warns them about it, inviting them to reject the lies they had come to accept, and believe in Him instead.

The real issue, then, is how they had come to believe the lies in the first place. To understand this, we must understand what had happened during the ministry of Jesus up to this point.

The Inability to Hear Developed Over Time

Jesus had come as the fulfillment of Jewish Messianic hopes, but since Jesus challenged many of the traditional Jewish teachings and traditions and refused to engage in a military campaign against the Romans, many of the Jewish people rejected Him as the promised Messiah (cf. John 1:11; 2:18; 5:31-47; 6:41-42; 7:25-31, 40-44).

John 8:43 cannot hearThe consistent message of Jesus to the Jewish people is that if they continued to reject Him as the Messiah, they would eventually become completely blind to His message and ministry.

As they continued to reject the clear teaching and the accompanying signs of Jesus which proved He was the Messiah, they sank deeper and deeper into darkness (cf. Matt 12:31-45). Along the way, Jesus continued to warn them and plead with them, but they refused to repent and believe.

What this means is that the condition of being unable to understand what Jesus is saying is not something that the Jewish people began with from birth, but is a condition that developed over time as they continued to deny the truth they had heard and ignored the signs they had seen.

Rather than believe the truth about Jesus, they had chosen to believe a lie.

In John 8 and other similar texts, Jesus warned them that although they had made their choices, they were coming to the point where their choices were making them. They had denied the truth about Jesus for so long, they were now at the point where they were completely blind and deaf to the truth when it was presented to them.

This self-deception was not permanent, and could be reversed if only the people who listen to Jesus and believe in Him.

Even in this very chapter, Jesus tells them the truth and invites them to believe (John 8:24, 45-46) before their unbelief become permanent. โ€œFrom a not wanting to hear develops a not able to hear, an incapacity of giving a hearing to the message of Jesus. Unbelief has become an attitude of lifeโ€ (Beasley-Murray, John: WBC, 135).

A Calvinist Agrees

Interestingly, one famous Calvinist agrees with this explanation:

Jesus does not say they fail to grasp his message because they cannot follow his spoken word, his idiom, but that they fail to understand his idiom because they cannot โ€œhearโ€ his message. The Jews remain responsible for their own โ€œcannot,โ€ which, far from resulting from divine fiat, is determined by their own desire (theolusin) to perform the lusts (tas epithumias) of the devil (8:44). This โ€œcannot,โ€ this slavery to sin (8:34), itself stems from personal sin (Carson, Divine Sovereignty, 166).

So John 8:43 is not a statement about the lifelong inability of some people to believe in Jesus for eternal life, but is a warning to those who reject the Gospel, continuing instead to deceive themselves.

The longer we reject the truth, the harder it becomes to believe it. Jesus wanted people then (and now) to believe in Him for eternal life so that they did not die in their sins.

If you want to read more about Calvinism, check out other posts in this blog series: Words of Calvinism and the Word of God.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Books by Jeremy Myers, Calvinism, John 8:43, sin, Theology of Salvation, Theology of Sin, Total Depravity, total inability, TULIP

The True Service of the Church

By Jeremy Myers
17 Comments

The True Service of the Church

I recently received an encouraging email from Ward Kelley, a long-time reader of this blog and someone I consider an “online” friend. I asked his permission to share his comments with you…

Good morning. I got up this morning and decided I would read your book Put service back into church service. As I have been struggling with the whole idea of what church really is…I find that your writings in this area the most applicable to my station in life. Pages 66-68 concerning church programs and their need for a finite life, and of feeding “Jim Handley’s” family while he found a job struck a chord with me.

be the church help othersLast month my wife — the social creature with a big heart that she is — met a couple through a woman’s prayer group at the church we attend who was pouring out her heart about their impending homelessness. We took them out to dinner to assess their situation and after finding out they had not approached the church for assistance I suggested they request aid through the church benevolence fund.

She approached the church by phone, though they had been attending for some time, seeking $1,500.00 to help them move into an apartment. The finance leader of the church, without even so much as a conversation, said that a check for $250.00 would be left at the front desk for her. Something is better than nothing, of course, but the woman felt that since the man had not cared enough to inquire into their situation, that he did not care about them as people. She felt he was dismissive, and the $250, while very generous, was not nearly enough to actually provide any help to their actual crisis.

I called and left message for the finance pastor and received no call back so I cornered him at church. I asked him if he could fill in some blanks for me concerning this family and he had no facts. He stated they got calls all the time for money and couldn’t get the details on every one. I am aware this happens as I was involved with benevolence at a previous church. When I reminded him that they were not strangers but part of this church’s family… He couldn’t get away from me fast enough.

Is this how we are to treat family?

So I decided to take matters into my own hands.

helping others get homes

I got more deeply involved searching out cheaper home alternatives for them and found several. Then I arranged a meeting to discuss in more depth with the husband his budget, and alternatives for them to live. My wife and I made it know that we were willing to help them bridge the gap with some financial and other assistance till they were back on their feet.

It was obvious that the work we did and the personal care we gave meant a lot to this family. My wife and I enjoyed it immensely as well!

Why didn’t the church do this for them?

Though of course, as you point out on your blog, since my wife and I “are the church” I suppose “the church” did help out this family…

In the end, the man decided to move his family in with his father rather than take one of the alternative routes I offered. A week later he asked for $300 to help with the transition. Had the finance pastor spent 15 minutes with this couple, listening, showing compassion, and guiding them biblically, he could have accomplished this in the name of the church.

Ironically this same finance pastor was busy preparing a “Church Event” of outreach to poor children in the community where they came to the church for free health and dental checkups, and haircuts. I cynically suggested to my wife that this was subliminally designed as a membership drive… Like so many churches they are expending massive time and money on programs to bring people in the front door, while they lose even more out the back door by not truly loving or caring for the people who are already there.

Again, a few weeks ago my wife found a young couple living in a tent behind a strip mall. She began by helping them by driving them around, and bringing them over to shower and wash their clothes. In subsequent conversations I believe that they are Christians … yet young and immature in the faith. Last week a storm blew through, knocked their tent down and soaked all their meager belongings, so they have been in our home since then. Some friends of ours offered to allow them to live in a travel trailer in their yard till they got back on their feet. We met last night as a group to decide a game plan for this young couple. My friend is also struggling with his role in the “church,” and is finding this sort of approach to be much closer to the way of Jesus.

Not all relationships are instant success stories!

Of course, it is critical to remember that even when serving others in such tangible ways, lives are messy, people change slowly, and there are numerous setbacks and we walk with people through their difficulties.

Take, for example, the couple that recently moved into our home with us. They were within oneย day of having the trailer ready to move into … and blew it.

The guy (James) took a day off from his contracting job to go over and finish the job. He decided that since he was off work that it would be a good day to buy a case of beer and get plastered. Once drunk he managed to get into a fight with the trailer owner’s son in law who was helping him. Needless to say, after being given a warning during our sit down meeting not to cause any drama … he was told never to come back.

After spending the night at an emergency department with him I directed my wife to take Mandy up to the local extended stay and pay for their first week.

It is frustrating in one sense working with dysfunctional people, even more so when they claim to be born again. Living in the south, everyone has biblical knowledge, and can talk a good game … but the discipleship, the love, the need to serve Christ are not present. We are going to continue to assist them, rides to work, church, grocery, etc. I reasserted to my friend and wife that sometimes serving Christ, and people, can get messy.

We don’t love and serve others for thank you’s or recognition, but to serve Christ.

Anyway, I think your writings in this and other books about the church are spot on. It is a struggle to make the transition, but I wanted you to know that your writings encourage me on to finding my place in the body of Christ, whether others find in unconventional or not.

Ward Kelly

Thank you, Ward! Your email is not only an encouragement to me, but to many others who are trying to follow Jesus in similar ways.

Here is a video from Keith Green that Ward sent along later which reminds us of this point:

Do any of you have similar stories to share about how God is using you to “be the church” in your neighborhood and community? Feel free to share them in the comments below!

God is z Bible & Theology Topics: be the church, Close Your Church for Good, Discipleship, homeless, love like Jesus, put service back into the church service, Theology of the Church

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