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Why you shouldnโ€™t suffer for Jesus

By Jeremy Myers
18 Comments

Why you shouldnโ€™t suffer for Jesus

I hear a lot of religious talk about how following God will lead to suffering and pain. How we must sacrifice ourselves for Jesus. While I do not at all deny that the New Testament does speak with this sort of language (cf. Rom 12:1-2), and while I completely agree that following Jesus will lead to troubles and trials (John 16:33), I think that religion sometimes places too great of an emphasis on the pain and the sorrow, and not enough emphasis on the joy and contentment.

Let me put it another way. I sometimes hear people say, “Jesus suffered and so should you.”

I’m just not so sure this logic is sound, nor am I sure it is biblical.

suffering for Jesus

To say that we need to become more like Jesus by following Jesus into suffering is like saying that we need to become more like God by following God into creating the universe.

Good luck with that…

While we certainly can be creative, none of us will ever create the universe.

Similarly, while we certainly will suffer in this life as followers of Jesus, Jesus does not call us to suffer as He suffered.

Yes, I know that we are to take up our cross and follow Him.

But to take up your cross and follow Jesus (Luke 9:23) is to take up your cross, not His.

take up your cross and follow JesusHe already carried His cross. He doesnโ€™t need or want or call us to carry His cross. Jesus carried His cross so that we would not have to. (Yes, yes, Simon carried it for him for a while, but when we talk about Jesus carrying His cross, weโ€™re not actually talking about Him carrying it, but about His death and suffering upon the crossโ€ฆ)

Jesus did not suffer and die so that we could follow Him into suffering.

I believe this sort of misapplication of the death of Jesus only grieves Jesus deeply.

Imagine if a criminal broke into your home and gave you the choice of torturing you or your child. You would obviously choose to have the criminal torture you to death. But what if, as your child grew up, they wanted so much to be like you, that they decided to start seeking out people to torture them? Is that why you chose to be tortured instead of your child? So that they could imitate you and become tortured also? No! You took the torture so that they could live free of torture, and it would grieve you if your child thought that by you taking torture for them, they had to be tortured themselves in order to be like you! You died so that your child might live!

So also with Jesus. Jesus died so that we might have life, and have it to the full (John 10:10). Jesus died, not so that we too might die as He did, but rather, so that we might live as He did.

So donโ€™t follow Jesus into suffering.

suffer with JesusYes, in this world, you will have troubles (John 16:33). But that is because this world is full of troubles. Jesus didnโ€™t want you to think that by following Him, you would escape all troubles. No, you will still have troubles, but you can bear them with the knowledge that they will lead to opportunities to glorify God and serve others.

Remember that people who do not follow Jesus also have troubles. But without the knowledge that God can use even their troubles to transform lives and bring restoration, redemption, healing, and hope, many people allow their troubles to get the best of them, and they turn to drugs, alcohol, entertainment, sex, or even death as an escape from their troubles.

Not so with the follower of Jesus! Our troubles are no different from the troubles of others, but we can redeem our troubles, knowing that God will use them for the good.

That is the only real difference between the troubles we have as followers of Jesus and the troubles that people face who do not follow Jesus.

We Christians sometimes adopt a martyr mentality, where we think our troubles are so much worse than the troubles that non-Christians face. But if you spend any amount of time in the lives of non-Christians, you will soon come to realize that this is not true.

All people face troubles, because this world is full of trouble and pain and sorrow and sickness and death.

everybody hurts

The thing that separates the follower of Jesus from the non-follower is not a lack of trouble or more troubles, but rather the fact that we believe God can redeem our troubles and use them for the good.

In fact, when we talk about suffering with Jesus, it might be best to realize that this does not mean that Jesus is calling us to suffer for Him. No, it means that when you suffer, Jesus is with you in the suffering. He does not send pain and suffering upon you, but rather walks with you through the pain and suffering when it comes.

This is what it means to take up your cross and follow Jesus. It means to imitate or follow Him, but not to copy Him. It means to view our suffering and troubles the way He viewed His … as something that God can redeem. Jesus did not want to suffer and die (and more than we want to experience the suffering and pain of life), but He knew that His suffering would result in the greatest revelation in human history.

Similarly, our troubles can also result in a revelation.

Revealing Suffering

When we walk with God through the pain and suffering of life, we gain a clearer picture of who God truly is, and especially, who we truly are. We also gain a picture of how we can walk with other people through their pain and suffering … NOT by quoting Bible verses at them and pounding them over the head with fear, guilt, and shame about the judgment and punishment of God, but by simply being with them, crying with them, serving them, and loving them, as God does for us.

But make no mistake. Just because God redeems pain and suffering, this does not mean that suffering is good. Suffering is bad.

God does not want anybody to suffer, nor does He send suffering on anybody.

But in the wisdom of God, good can come out of bad suffering. Just as the glorious gifts of redemption, reconciliation, and revelation came from the badness of the cross, so God can bring good out of the bad things that happen in our life as well.

To imitate Jesus is not to imitate Him in His suffering, but to imitate Him in His love.

To become like Jesus is not chase after pain and rejection from others, but to chase after opportunities to serve others like Jesus.

God is Redeeming Life Bible & Theology Topics: John 16:33, life is hard, pain, Romans 12:1-2, suffering

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Waving the White Flag Before the Onslought of God’s Violence

By Jeremy Myers
58 Comments

Waving the White Flag Before the Onslought of God’s Violence

RETREAT!!!!!

I give up.

I wave the white flag.

I surrender.

I hang my head in defeat.

I slink off into the woods with my tail between my legs.

waving the white flag

Over a year ago I set out to put a theory of mine down on paper about how to reconcile the violence of God with the self-sacrificial non-violence of Jesus Christ. The theory had been percolating in my mind for over a decade, and I finally decided to tackle the issue head on.

After 100,000 words, I give up.

If you read this blog much last year, it is almost the only thing I posted on… up until October 13. Then the posts stopped.

Why?

Because I hit a road block. A pot hole. A speed bump. A dead end.

What was the road block?

Only one little thing called…

…Scripture.

Most of what I had written was a hypothesis, a theory, about how to reconcile the violence of God in the Old Testament with the sacrificial love of Jesus in the New. My book was called When God Pled Guilty, and I was basically arguing that just as Jesus took the sins of the world upon Himself on the cross, so also, somehow, the violent portrayals of God in the Old Testament is God taking the sins of Israel upon Himself through the testimony of inspired Scripture.

In other words, to the outside observer, Jesus hanging on a cross looks guilty (even though He wasn’t). So also, a casual reading of the Old Testament makes God look guilty (even though He isn’t).

I thought that there were enough hints and clues scattered through the Bible to show that the violent portrayals of God in the Old Testament are really just Him taking the blame and shouldering the responsibility for the bad things that happen in this world which He does not prevent from happening.

I thought I had a pretty good theory going…. until I tried to get the theory to match with the violent portrayals of God in Scripture. I soon found that all my theorizing hadn’t gotten me past the 1 yard line… of my own side of the field. I still had 99 yards to go, and the defense was shutting me down faster than the Seahawks shut down Peyton Manning…. (sorry Bronco fans…. I wanted Manning to win too).

Sigh.

Honestly, I should have seen it coming. Want to know why?

My wife was never convinced.

My wife is the greatest theologian and Bible scholar I know.

She has what I call “intuitive theology.” She doesn’t read a lot of books or spend dozens of hours each week studying… but she always knows more theology than I do, and always asks penetrating questions which shoot holes through all my acadamagician ideas (Yes, I just coined that term… it’s a cross between academic and magician… because that’s what most theology is. We throw some verses in a pot, mix in some fancy Greek and Hebrew and a quote from Barth, mix it up, blow smoke in people’s faces, and then Voila! — A book that everyone must buy!)

Anyway, my wife was never convinced of my theory, and so I should have known it was doomed from the start.

Another nail in the coffin though, was when I was recently interviewed by Drew Marshall (listen to the audio) and when I briefly mentioned this idea to him, he asked if I had been smoking marijuana. Ha!

But aside from my wife and Drew, there are a few other reasons I am abandoning this theory.

1. Occam’s Razor

No, this is not a new razor put out by Gillette (Now with 8 Blades!!!).

Occam’s razor is a principle used in science and other problem-solving fields which states the simplest solution is often right. Specifically (according to Wikipedia), Occam’s razor states that among competing hypotheses, the hypothesis with the fewest assumptions should be selected.

If you did any reading of my hypothesis, you know that it was not simple. It is not a hypothesis with the fewest assumptions. To the contrary, my hypothesis was so complex, so difficult to grasp, and so full of details, I myself had trouble keeping it all straight in my own head!

Heck, I had already written 100,000 words on the topic, and was only about half-way done. (A typical 200 page book is about 60,000 words.)

2. Modern Disasters

A second reason I am giving up is because ultimately, I had no good explanation for the most difficult question of all… which is why bad things happen today. My hypothesis did very little to provide an explanation for this.

In my (abandoned) theory, I argued that the Old Testament portrays God holding back disasters upon people until, as a result of their great evil, they departed from God’s protective hand. I think that this can actually be seen time and time again in Scripture.

But then, what does this mean for the victims of Hurricane Katrina, or the December 26, 2004 tsunami that killed almost 250,000 people? How does my theory explain people like Hitler and Mussolini getting to live so long while they brought incredible amounts of evil upon the world? How comes they seemingly hadn’t departed from God’s protective hand? 

What did my theory have to say to the millions and millions of little girls who are sold into sex slavery to be raped by as many as 40 or 50 men every single day?

Nothing.

Other than that “God didn’t do it,” my hypothesis could say nothing helpful, loving, kind, or hopeful to such situations or such people caught in a living hell.

3. Couldn’t Even Refute the Calvinists

I am actually not that interested in “refuting” Calvinists, but one area of Calvinistic theology which has always troubled me is the insistence by some that since God is sovereign, He is the cause of everything. If you press them, some will say that while God is not the “author” of evil, He is the primary cause behind all evil, sin, and suffering in the world. (For examples, see John Piper’s quotes here and here.)

John Piper slaughter women and children

Calvinists say that everything that happens in the world is because God’s wills it to happen.

So when a family gets in a car accident and the husband and wife escape, but their children die in a ball of flame when the car explodes, their Calvinistic pastor says that while we don’t understand why such things are God’s will, we must trust that God knows what He is doing because everything happens is according to His will. (This really happened, by the way).

The same argument is applied to Katrina, tsunamis, Hitler, and the raping of little girls.

In my opinion, such a god is monstrous, and is not worthy of worship.

But in the hypothesis I was presenting, I was saying that God “inspired” human authors to write negatively about Him in Scripture so that He could take responsibility for the bad things which happened on earth which He did not prevent from happening.

If that is true, then why I am upset at Calvinists for saying that God caused the bad things that they were ascribing to Him? If my hypothesis is true, isn’t saying “God willed your children to die in a burning car while you watched” the same thing as saying, “God sent a flood upon the earth so that everything which had breath died a horrible death by drowning”?

In my view, of course, God didn’t actually do either thing, but also in my view, God is willing to take the blame for that which He does not prevent, so I shouldn’t get too upset when people blame God for the evil things that happen in the world. After all, God apparently inspired some biblical authors to say the very same things about Him!

If God takes the blame for that which He does not prevent, then it is not wrong to blame God for the horrible events which happen in the world which He does not prevent.

This I could not accept.

4. Back to Ignorance

ignoranceLast month I spent several days reading, editing, revising, and arguing with myself about the 100,000 words I had written.

I got the end (which was actually the middle, because the second half hadn’t been written yet), I realized I could have saved myself 99,997 words, and just written, “I don’t know.”

My fancy 100,000 word answer turned out to be little more than a long way of saying, “I have no idea how to reconcile the violence of God in the Old Testament with the self-sacrificial love of Jesus Christ in the New while still maintaining a conservative view of inspiration and inerrancy.”

Yes, I know. Many of you think I should just abandon inerrancy.

I would really hate to do that.

Pray for Me, Please?

Believe it nor not, this is a crisis of faith for me.

I cannot, CANNOT believe that the God revealed in Jesus Christ is the same God who drowns millions, burns cities, and commands His people to slaughter women, children, and animals.

Something else is going on in the text, but I just cannot figure out what.

My wife, with her intuitive theology, says it is something that cannot ever be figured out.

But my brain, which God gave me, cannot live with the tension. Something must give.

I seem to be left with only two options: Either Jesus truly is violent like God and He was hiding this dark side from us during His ministry, or Jesus truly revealed God to us and the violent portrayals of God in the Old Testament are in error.


The day after writing that post, when I was at work, a new thought occurred to me. A key, I’ll call it. It allowed much of the original hypothesis to remain intact, but organized it all around a central thesis which simplified and clarified the entire idea. 

Although… just as I am writing this paragraph… a new thought has occurred to me…. what if? No. It can’t be.

Hmmm….

A brand new theory has just presented itself…

It seems simple…

Memorable…

Elegant…

…Heretical.

Hmm. I better run it by my wife…

If I decide to share it, you’ll be the first to know!

As a side note, many who read my blog tell me that Greg Boyd is coming out with a book later this year that sounds similar to what I was arguing. When I first heard this, I read some of his blog posts and listened to some of his sermons, and honestly, I cannot tell if he is arguing the same thing or not. I guess we will see. Apparently, if the ideas are similar, he has not hit the same road blocks I have… I look forward to reading his book… I think it is called The Crucifixion of the Warrior God.


Note: I wrote the preceding post last Saturday. As you see at the end, in the process of writing the post, a new idea occurred to me. I thought more about it on Sunday, prayed about it, looked at some key biblical texts, and (maybe most important of all – ha!) talked to my wife. She is still not convinced, but she sees promise in the idea. So, I’m back in the saddle again. Hopefully some new posts on understanding the violence of God will be published soon… I am still not sure my new approach has adequate answers to the four problems I stated above, but I think it is a move in the right direction.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: Calvinism, evil, Greg Boyd, Jesus, John Piper, suffering, Theology of Jesus, violence of God, When God Pled Guilty

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15 Things NOT to Say at a Funeral (or to anybody in pain)

By Jeremy Myers
23 Comments

15 Things NOT to Say at a Funeral (or to anybody in pain)

It is always difficult to know what to say at a funeral or to people in pain. Usually, unless we have experienced great pain, suffering, or loss in our own life, we stick our foot in our mouth and say the wrong thing. Sometimes, in painful situations, it is better to not say anything at all, then to try to comfort those who are grieving only to offend or hurt them further.

Not to make light of a painful situation, but too often, we are like this guy:

what not to say at a funeral

We want to say the right thing, but since we never know what to say at a funeral, we end up saying something stupid or offensive.

what not to say at a funeralSo although it is difficult to know what to say to someone who is grieving or suffering, here are fifteen things NOT to say at a funeral (or to others in pain). These statements are little more than Christian cliches, and aside from not helping anybody, they do not accurately represent God or Scripture.

  1. Don’t take it so hard.
  2. God is still on the throne.
  3. Try to hold back your tears; they make people uncomfortable.
  4. Remember to give thanks in all things.
  5. It’s probably for the best.
  6. God knows what He is doing.
  7. It could have been worse.
  8. She (he) is better off now.
  9. Don’t question God.
  10. God must really love you to have selected you for this burden.
  11. Your child (spouse, parent, etc) will be raised again.
  12. I know what you are experiencing; my dog died last month.
  13. God is refining you. There must be some sin He is rooting out of your life.
  14. God is preparing you for something better.
  15. God is preparing you for something worse.

I always like to remember Job’s friends. It is only after they opened their mouths that they became miserable comforters (Job 16:2).

Do you have questions about any of these fifteen or have one to add? Include it in the comments below.

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: comfort, death, Discipleship, Job 16:2, pain, suffering

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God Knows What it is Like to Experience the Death of a Child

By Jeremy Myers
5 Comments

God Knows What it is Like to Experience the Death of a Child

A reader recently sent in the following questions about the death of Jesus as the Son of God and how it affected God the Father. Specifically, they wanted to know if God knew what it was like to experience the death of a child. Here is the question:

I am a believer, but I am troubled by an atheist’s questions. I was talking to an atheist the other day, and he said that God doesn’t know what it’s like to experience the death of a child because he knew all along that Jesus would rise in three days, so he only lost him for the weekend! He also questioned that if God is Jesus, why did he beg to be saved from the cross when he was in the garden? Also, shouldn’t Jesus already have known he would rise again in three days? Why did he ask God, “Why have you forsaken me?” Wouldn’t he know that he’s only going to be dead three days?

I am answering these questions over the course of four blog posts in the following order:

  1. How to Answer Questions of Atheists
  2. 2 Traditional Explanations for How God knows what it is Like to Lose a Son (both of which I reject)
  3. 2 Ways God Knows What it is like to Experience the Death of a Child
  4. Why did Jesus say, “My God, My God, Why have You forsaken Me?”

So in this post, I will look at two ways that God does indeed know what it is like to experience the death of a child, and in fact, knows better than we do what it is like.

God Knows What it is Like to Experience the Death of a Child

I believe that Godย doesย know what it is like to experience the death of a child. In fact, I believe thatย God knows better than anyone else what it is like to lose a child.

We can see this in at least two ways.

1. When Jesus Became Sin, God’s Eternal Relationship with Jesus was Shattered

God did not experience the death of a child the same way that humans do. When Jesus died on the cross, it is true that God did not experience His death the same way that human parents experience the death of their son or daughter. But this does not mean that there was no loss on the part of God, that there was no pain, that there was no suffering.

death of a childQuite to the contrary, it could be argued that in the death of Jesus, God experienced greater loss, greater pain, and greater suffering than do human parents.

2 Corinthians 5:21 says that on the cross,ย Jesus became sin for us. He took our sin upon Himself. While it is nearly impossible to understand exactly how this happened or what occurred, we can know that whatever it means, it would have caused excruciating anguish and torment for both God the Father and God the Son. We have lived with sin our entire lives. We have become accustomed to it. We cannot imagine an existence without sin.

But God is holy, righteous, and good. He is love and light. What then must it mean for Him to knew no sin to become sin for us? What must it have been like for God to see the holiness of His one and only son get exchanged (or covered, or extinguished, or whatever verb best fits with your theology of the atonement) with the totality of all sin ever committed by every human in the history of the world? We humans cannotย imagine the sufferingย and the torment that this must have caused.

Worse yet, the sin that Jesus bore caused a rift to open in His relationship with God the Father. The sin caused a separation. This is why Jesus cried out from the cross, “My God, My God, Why have you forsaken me?” This is the cry of God the Son experiencing for the first time in eternity a separation from God the Father.ย The suffering and sacrifice was so great, that it shattered the eternal relationship between God the Father and God the Son. This also is something we humans cannot imagine. We are pained when separated from our loved ones whom we have known for several years, or several decades. But God the Father and God the Son have existed eternally in relationship with one another. Sin caused them to be separated.

And while both God the Father and Jesus the Son knew that Jesus would rise again, there was a pain in their separation that can never be matched by the most painful loss which any human being can experience.

Look at it this way: Though plants are “alive” (in some sense), they do not experience pain or loss when one of their “baby” plants die. Up the creation spectrum a little bit, we have animals. Many animals parents (though not all) do experience pain or loss when one of their children dies. But going up the creation spectrum to the top, it seems that humans experience the greatest pain and suffering when we are separated from our children by death.

But God is infinitely “higher” than humans in every way, and therefore, must experience an infinitely greater loss at the pain, suffering, and loss of His Son, even though He knew He would be reunited with His son shortly.ย The knowledge of the resurrection did not dissipate the pain and suffering that God experienced when Jesus bore the sin of the world into death.

Again, think about the situation as a parent. Let us say that you knew your child was going to die, and that your child would rise again from the dead in three days. But before your child died, they would have to experience the most excruciating and painful torment ever imaginable. Would their pain and death be any easier for you to handle, even knowing that they would rise again in three days? No, I do not think so.

How much more so for God? Though the situation was a bit different when God lost His son than when parents lose their children, it can be argued that God knows the pain of suffering and the torment of a lost loved one in deeper ways and with greater agony than do human parents. God does know the pain of losing a child. Since death is the antithesis and complete opposite of everything that is “God” for Jesus to die would be the greatest and more terrible experience of the death of a child, especially when the child is the Son of God.

But there is another way that God has experienced the death of a child.

2. Every Person is One of God’s Children

We sometimes seem to forget that every single person is (in some sense) one of God’s children. Even those who rebel against God and who never return to Him are viewed by Him as His lost and wayward children. He looks after each and every person on earth throughout history. He looks earnestly down the road every day, hoping that his wayward children will return to Him.

And when each and every person dies, whether young or old, God suffers through their death. Death, remember, was not God’s plan or desire for the world. When any person dies, it wrenches the heart of God. Death torments God day and night.

When we suffer over the loss of our loved ones, God suffers with us.

When we cry out in pain over the death of a child, God cries with us.

When we scream until we have no voice and sob until we have no tears, God continues to scream with a voice that never cracks and sob with eyes that never run dry.

When you suffer over the death of a child, a parent, a spouse, a sibling, a friend, or any loved one, know that God suffers also. However much you suffer over the loss of your loved ones, God suffers more. He knows what it is like to experience the death of a child, because all people are his sons and daughters. He “gave birth” to us. He brought us forth. He cared for us. Tended us. Brought us up. Planned for our future. Laughed and danced and sang with us.

death of a childAnd when death strikes, God is there, grieving and mourning over the death of yet another child.

God knows what it is like to lose a child, not just because of Jesus, but because He experiences the pain of death whenever any person dies.

I think that more than anything, when a person is going through intense pain and suffering and they cry out to God in anger, despair, or frustration, while they do not really want theological answers or Scripture quotations, one thing they do want is to know that God is with them in their pain and suffering, and that He is suffering right along with them.

This idea that God suffers when we suffer is one way to encourage people to see the love and care of God in our lives, even when we experience the death of a child or face any other type of pain in life.

The cross of Jesus is CENTRAL to everything!

Transform your life and theology by focusing on the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus:

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God is Redeeming Theology Bible & Theology Topics: cruciform, crucivision, death, death of a child, death of Jesus, pain, suffering, Theology of God, Theology of Jesus, Theology of Sin

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The Greatest Act of Courage

By Jeremy Myers
20 Comments

The Greatest Act of Courage

Courage Nelson MandelaNelson Mandela once said โ€œCourage was not the absence of fear, but the triumph over it. The brave man is not he who does not feel afraid, but he who conquers that fear.โ€

This is a great insight.

Although maybe John Wayne said it slightly better: “Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway.”

People sometimes think that the courageous person does not feel fear in the midst of great danger and potential personal harm. But this is not true. If someone is facing great danger and they feel no fear, they are not courageous, but ignorant and foolish. Fear is natural and normal in dangerous situations. The courageous person is not someone who feels no fear, but who runs headlong into danger despite the fear.

Yet while I like this understanding of courage, it is usually only applied to acts of valor that we might see on a battlefield or in a daring rescue operation. We think of the soldier who charges forward against a spray of enemy bullets to rescue a wounded comrade. We think of a policeman who stands alone against criminals intent on doing harm, holding them back until reinforcements arrive. We think of firemen who enter burning buildings to pull terrified children from the flames.

These are all, undoubtedly, great acts of courage.ย But I do not think they are the greatest possible act of courage. No,ย the greatest possible act of courage is the courage it takes to forgive.

The Courage to Forgive

When we are wronged, slandered, hurt, or abused, our entire body, soul, and spirit screams against the idea of forgiveness. We want revenge! We want retaliation! We want the person who did us wrong to suffer as we have suffered.

But more than that, we do not want to be hurt in the same way again. We fear that if we forgive someone for what they have done, they will continue to abuse and hurt us in similar ways.

[Read more…]

God is Uncategorized Bible & Theology Topics: courage, cross, Discipleship, fear, forgiveness, Jesus, love, Nelson Mandela, suffering, synchroblog

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